~ Is that "Ggoat" thing intentional? edited by Tommy Wi on 9/2/2013[/li][li]
[/li][li]"Ask the Goat’s opinion" is still same in its reward. Let’s try Ggoat one.[/li][li] edited by Tommy Wi on 9/2/2013
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[color=#009900]Because of our requirement:[/color]
http://www.failbettergames.com/?page_id=594 : "We do not give permission to quote our content in large chunks, in a wiki or elsewhere. Reproduction of Failbetter-copyrighted content – in wikis or elsewhere – must be limited to illustrative or particularly important quotes, and summaries or synopses of storylines. Cataloguing outcomes is fine. Copying and pasting most of the game is not."
[color=#009900]We know that some players like to be able to refer to all the game text, but aside from any other considerations, we’ve been advised that allowing our content to be freely reproduced on the web may jeopardise our ability to claim copyright. This would potentially destroy Failbetter, so we can’t allow it: end of story.[/color]
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[color=#009900]The snipped content on the wikia wiki is a bit chancy, especially since it’s still there in the underlying database, but it’s an acceptable compromise for now, and we thank the wiki admins for being proactive about it.[/color]
Not entirely memory I searched Tree of Ages on the wiki, just knew I had seen the phrase somewhere. On your other point I understand that Failbetter don’t want all the content available without playing through the stories and I understand that. Unfortunately memory is fallible and I don’t echo everything.
Yes, that is really stupid. Seriously, you can just see it when you use "Edit" button, so it exist as purely bureaucratic reason. I wouldn’t complain if that message appears at the end of paragraph, but… Sure, I know it is copyrighted, but what about [color=#ffffff]making it only visible to registered users? [/color]
[color=#009900]Because of our requirement:[/color]
[li]
[/li][li]http://www.failbettergames.com/?page_id=594 : "We do not give permission to quote our content in large chunks, in a wiki or elsewhere. Reproduction of Failbetter-copyrighted content – in wikis or elsewhere – must be limited to illustrative or particularly important quotes, and summaries or synopses of storylines. Cataloguing outcomes is fine. Copying and pasting most of the game is not."
[color=#009900]We know that some players like to be able to refer to all the game text, but aside from any other considerations, we’ve been advised that allowing our content to be freely reproduced on the web may jeopardise our ability to claim copyright. This would potentially destroy Failbetter, so we can’t allow it: end of story.[/color]
[color=#009900]
[/color]
[color=#009900]The snipped content on the wikia wiki is a bit chancy, especially since it’s still there in the underlying database, but it’s an acceptable compromise for now, and we thank the wiki admins for being proactive about it.[/color][/quote]
[/li][li]I understand. What about making Journals more interactive? I currently don’t Echo much because in the end it ends up piled under dozens of other Echoes, so when I want to retrieve something it’s a practically impossible grind through old entries. Mabye seomtehing like a "search" function or a way to select them chronologically? (Sidethought: these little round spots are annoying. Is there a default "punctuated list" active? O_o)
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[li]
[color=#009900]As I hinted in my last post, I’ve been turning a blind eye to this inconvenient fact because it represents an acceptable compromise.[/color]
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[/color]
[color=#009900]But apparently some players (Tommy’s not the first, though he’s the first to describe it as ‘stupid’) are determined to call it to my attention.[/color]
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[/color]
[color=#009900]If any of the wiki admins are reading this, can you get in touch with me at the support@failbettergames.com address so we can talk about how to proceed from here in a way that doesn’t involve closing the wiki down? Otherwise I’ll leave messages on the wiki once we’ve got the Kickstarter started.[/color]
[quote=streetfelineblue][color=#009900]Because of our requirement:[/color]
[li]
[/li][li]http://www.failbettergames.com/?page_id=594 : "We do not give permission to quote our content in large chunks, in a wiki or elsewhere. Reproduction of Failbetter-copyrighted content – in wikis or elsewhere – must be limited to illustrative or particularly important quotes, and summaries or synopses of storylines. Cataloguing outcomes is fine. Copying and pasting most of the game is not."
[color=#009900]We know that some players like to be able to refer to all the game text, but aside from any other considerations, we’ve been advised that allowing our content to be freely reproduced on the web may jeopardise our ability to claim copyright. This would potentially destroy Failbetter, so we can’t allow it: end of story.[/color]
[color=#009900]
[/color]
[color=#009900]The snipped content on the wikia wiki is a bit chancy, especially since it’s still there in the underlying database, but it’s an acceptable compromise for now, and we thank the wiki admins for being proactive about it.[/color][/quote]
[/li][li]I understand. What about making Journals more interactive? I currently don’t Echo much because in the end it ends up piled under dozens of other Echoes, so when I want to retrieve something it’s a practically impossible grind through old entries. Mabye seomtehing like a "search" function or a way to select them chronologically? (Sidethought: these little round spots are annoying. Is there a default "punctuated list" active? O_o)
[/li][/quote]
Yes, current journal system is too troublesome. I tried to use Google doc as more viewer and user friendly alternative, but it was breach of guideline so I made it private only.
[quote=streetfelineblue](Sidethought: these little round spots are annoying. Is there a default "punctuated list" active? O_o)[/quote]It’s a little troublesome. If you click the HTML button and change each square-bracketed ‘ul’ and ‘/ul’ to ‘ol’ and ‘/ol’, you get a numbered list. Like this:
[li]
[color=#009900]As I hinted in my last post, I’ve been turning a blind eye to this inconvenient fact because it represents an acceptable compromise.[/color]
[color=#009900]
[/color]
[color=#009900]But apparently some players (Tommy’s not the first, though he’s the first to describe it as ‘stupid’) are determined to call it to my attention.[/color]
[color=#009900]
[/color]
[color=#009900]If any of the wiki admins are reading this, can you get in touch with me at the support@failbettergames.com address so we can talk about how to proceed from here in a way that doesn’t involve closing the wiki down? Otherwise I’ll leave messages on the wiki once we’ve got the Kickstarter started.[/color][/quote][/li][li]
[color=rgb(0, 153, 0)]As I hinted in my last post, I’ve been turning a blind eye to this inconvenient fact because it represents an acceptable compromise.[/color]
[color=rgb(0, 153, 0)]But apparently some players (Tommy’s not the first, though he’s the first to describe it as ‘stupid’) are determined to call it to my attention.[/color]
[/quote]
First, let me apologize for saying "stupid". I fully understand that as holder of copyright, people of FBG have rightful right to right what they see as not right. I was just frustrated…
It would be awesome if there could be some interactivity toward Wiki in game like that blue Feedback button*, something that legendary deus ex mode. Of course, that’s unrealistic in so many level, so I only dream…
*speaking of which, is that forum still alive? It looks very dead…
[quote]Ohmygod please don’t close the wikis down T.T
[/quote]
…If my action is responsible for closing down of FBG wiki, I’ll just give my character to anyone who wnats it as I does not deserve to enjoy this game after such terrible sin.[li] edited by Tommy Wi on 9/2/2013
…If my action is responsible for closing down of FBG wiki, I’ll just give my character to anyone who wnats it as I does not deserve to enjoy this game after such terrible sin. edited by Tommy Wi on 9/2/2013[/quote]
Well now, no panic. I’m sure they’ll find a reasonable way to cope with the matter. Seriously, I can’t even think of playing Fallen London without the wikis help, both for the synthetic guides and the mnemonic support. Moreover, wikis worked fine until now, why change them again?
Oh handsome tiger, sheathe your claws,
Return those points to your silken paws.
The foolish Wi admits his fault;
He didn’t mean ill (the foolish dolt).
He’ll do a penance, just you see-
and if not we’ll kill him and make him your tea.
Edit: IT WAS A TYPO YOU ARSE. x edited by babelfishwars on 9/2/2013
[color=#009900]O drama![/color]
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[color=#009900]Tommy, no sin here beyond tactlessness. SFB, they worked fine for players, but they represented an ongoing serious risk for us that we were going to have to tackle eventually.[/color]
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[/color]
[color=#009900]I don’t want to close the wiki(s) down. My ideal state for the wikis is a reference guide that uses illustrative quotes and summaries in all cases, not substantial copy/paste. [/color][color=rgb(0, 153, 0)]However there is a huge quantity of text in there already and all the wiki editors are volunteers, so getting there from here is not straightforward and will involve some compromise.[/color]
[color=rgb(0, 153, 0)]
[/color]
[color=rgb(0, 153, 0)]I’m sure if we can talk to some active wiki community types, we can sort something out, but we do now need to sort something out. It will have to wait until after tomorrow, though. :)[/color]
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[quote=Alexis Kennedy][color=#009900]O drama![/color]
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[/color]
[color=#009900]Tommy, no sin here beyond tactlessness. SFB, they worked fine for players, but they represented an ongoing serious risk for us that we were going to have to tackle eventually.[/color]
[color=#009900]
[/color]
[color=#009900]I don’t want to close the wiki(s) down. My ideal state for the wikis is a reference guide that uses illustrative quotes and summaries in all cases, not substantial copy/paste. [/color][color=rgb(0, 153, 0)]However there is a huge quantity of text in there already and all the wiki editors are volunteers, so getting there from here is not straightforward and will involve some compromise.[/color]
[color=rgb(0, 153, 0)]
[/color]
[color=rgb(0, 153, 0)]I’m sure if we can talk to some active wiki community types, we can sort something out, but we do now need to sort something out. It will have to wait until after tomorrow, though. :)[/color]
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[color=#00cc00]O k![/color][/li]
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Speaking of which, I was considering about creating guides in style of "echobazaar.wikidot.com", as their guide articles are very easy to read and helpful ( If very outdated ). Not sure how would I actually do it, though.
By the way, is there some way to "tip" Nex in Fallen London like other SN games? There are some gems that won’t do justice with mere echoing, and there are some stuff that are disappointing enough that should be pelted with tomato. (Too bad that in Neath, surface-imported tomato are considered as magnificient gift.) I especially love how I shall go insane and eat my crews, made me chuckle for week.
[quote=Tommy Wi]
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By the way, is there some way to "tip" Nex in Fallen London like other SN games? [/quote]
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[/li]The traditional tipping method is to upgrade the KS Sunless Sea tier you were going to get to whatever is the next one above. ;-)
Can’t you grant the right for that particular wiki to quote text fully without losing the ability to enforce copyright elsewhere? I mean there are books you can read online, and the authors of those books do not lose their rights. Probably. Do they?
And yeah, please don’t remove that text. Without the wiki I would forget most of the storylines. I would forget all the beautiful words. T_T
I mean surely there must be some way active and paying customers can be granted the right to reread the text of your work, without that hurting your company. The journal system simply does not work. And improving it would be a waste of precious time, when a legion of volunteers does the job better than any log system ever could.
[quote=Fhoenix]Can’t you grant the right for that particular wiki to quote text fully without losing the ability to enforce copyright elsewhere? I mean there are books you can read online, and the authors of those books do not lose their rights. Probably. Do they?
And yeah, please don’t remove that text. Without the wiki I would forget most of the storylines. I would forget all the beautiful words. T_T
I mean surely there must be some way active and paying customers can be granted the right to reread the text of your work, without that hurting your company. The journal system simply does not work. And improving it would be a waste of precious time, when a legion of volunteers does the job better than any log system ever could.[/quote]
I agree on anything. Also, I think wikis improve the spirit of collaboration between players, working together to make a whole of the puzzle of information Fallen London provides.