You weren’t being a pratt, your reply was funny ;)
And true, as well. I did mix up morals and ethics , and I appreciate it being pointed out.
edited by Kukapetal on 4/11/2016
[quote=Robin Mask]I’m going to be harsh, as I’m exhausted, and say:
"Most of your rebuttal, my good friend, is poppycock".
I present to you this quote from the first thing Google threw at me: [color=#ffffff]"Morals are the principles on which one’s judgments of right and wrong are based. Ethics are principles of right conduct. So the two nouns are closely related and are often interchangeable. The main difference is that morals are more abstract, subjective, and often personal or religion-based, while ethics are more practical, conceived as shared principles promoting fairness in social and business interactions. "[/color]
To offer you an example based on what you said; you said that killing to save others or yourself is not immoral, but I very much and utterly disagree . . . mainly as I like to play devil’s advocate. Many religions say that it is wrong to kill, period. There are many that even go so far as to say that you should allow a physical death, as your killing a person would damn your soul; example, if you kill the killer, you both go to hell, whereas letting him live would mean you go to heaven and they to hell. Meanwhile, there are others that think killing is perfectly moral in far more circumstances; it is ‘moral’ to use capital punishment to kill a killer, or ‘moral’ to assist in a suicide (see Switzerland for a RL example of such a thing).
Morality is relative.
Morality is the individual’s concept of right or wrong, so what is moral to one is immoral to another.
These stories test the basis for morality and make us question it, and ourselves and own choices; in Comtessa, you say morality would be to do what she wanted, as it’s wrong to take away a person’s right to choose. What if she was mentally incapable of making a choice (due to mental illness, age, etc.)? What if her choice would have inadvertently affected others, thus infringing upon their rights? What if a lot of darned things, which often exist in any scenario - in any in-game or RL choice - that factor in to make things various shades of grey.
Now I leave to the cosy depths of my bed.
Farewell, dear Neath’er.
(edited quote colour to make visible) [quote]
Fair enough. I did mix up morals and ethics and I appreciate you pointing it out.
Edit: Sorry, I don’t know how to change the quote color
edited by Kukapetal on 4/11/2016
This story does answer why joining the Young Stags gives you a +2 to Dreaded. I’d always wondered about that. Yes, they are vicious and highly skilled pranksters (pranking the Duchess is not to be sneezed at!), but a +2 Dreaded seemed a little extravagant for mere practical jokes. Now we know.
sighs
sighs[/quote]
^
[color=#ff9900]We’ve identified what causes the echoing bug - it’s quite a specific circumstance. We hope to fix it in the future, but it’s unlikely that’ll be before the current Exceptional Story switches over to the next one - so make sure you unlock this one at the House of Chimes if you’re waiting![/color]
[color=#ff9900]
[/color]
[color=#ff9900]In the meantime we’ll be working around the triggering conditions in future content, to try and prevent it recurring.[/color]
I hope that you don’t mind me asking a related question.
Is there a chance that you could work on the bug related to an echo starting with a quotation mark while you are at it? Or perhaps setting an internal style guide that discourages its use? More recent work seems to have this problem much more frequently than older stories, where an echo’s title starting with a quotation mark means that recording it blanks the title’s field.
[color=#ff9900]UPDATE! Thanks to a flurry of ingenuity from various members of the content team, the Seven-Day Reign should no longer cause errors when you echo it to your journal. We had to tweak some of the text to make this work, but nothing major has changed.[/color]
Woah! Quick work, content team!
Nice job indeed.
[color=#e53e00]The quotation mark breaking recording of titles to journal should prove less problematic now, too.[/color]
edited by babelfishwars on 4/12/2016
Without quoting all of Robin Mask’s arguments, Trodgmey’s character is a retiring, resigned, but still resolutely committed to maintaining his own morality in Fallen London. This is basically an amplification of one particular part of my personality, and has made for a very satisfying way to play through Fallen London.
I’ve basically given up several portions of the game at this point, like the Labyrinth of Tigers, because I used the content-resets to go back, thinking I’d like to play through some of the earlier parts again, but now have to go and kill someone for Mr. Inch in order to progress. Refusing to do that, there’s an entire run of storylets that I can’t get to. Still won’t do it – it’s more important to play Trodgmey the character than it is to get access to content. Even knowing that death isn’t permanent, he won’t do it.
The better FL storylets allow for this, albeit with sacrificed content or opportunities. That’s fine. However, the Stags are exactly the kind of group in FL that Trodgmey is repulsed by. This isn’t an argument about a correct morality, this is playing the morality that I’ve assigned to my character. Based on conversations here, there’s a decent number of other FL players who play in a similar way.
You don’t have to kill anyone for Mr Inch to progress. It is just a one-time cash in for a bit of the Hunt is On.
<3
does a little happy dance ^_^
[quote=Trodgmey ]Without quoting all of Robin Mask’s arguments, Trodgmey’s character is a retiring, resigned, but still resolutely committed to maintaining his own morality in Fallen London. This is basically an amplification of one particular part of my personality, and has made for a very satisfying way to play through Fallen London.
I’ve basically given up several portions of the game at this point, like the Labyrinth of Tigers, because I used the content-resets to go back, thinking I’d like to play through some of the earlier parts again, but now have to go and kill someone for Mr. Inch in order to progress. Refusing to do that, there’s an entire run of storylets that I can’t get to. Still won’t do it – it’s more important to play Trodgmey the character than it is to get access to content. Even knowing that death isn’t permanent, he won’t do it.
The better FL storylets allow for this, albeit with sacrificed content or opportunities. That’s fine. However, the Stags are exactly the kind of group in FL that Trodgmey is repulsed by. This isn’t an argument about a correct morality, this is playing the morality that I’ve assigned to my character. Based on conversations here, there’s a decent number of other FL players who play in a similar way.[/quote]
No, I completely get that, and your character sounds like the kind of guy who actually has a leg to stand on when scoffing at the Stags…because he’s nicer than they are. My point was simply that most of us aren’t nicer than the Stags(originally were). We’re much much worse (and yes, I include my own character here as well). And we hang out with a lot of people who are far worse too, and don’t make much of a fuss about it. Therefore, the hate directed at the Stags seemed quite out of proportion to the amount of evil they originally did.
It’s like being best buddies with a serial killer (or even being a serial killer yourself) but chastising a kid who deliberately stomps on an ant.
Speaking for myself in-character, I don’t exactly like the Stags, but I’m not holding myself above them either. Though I do like to think that I hold on to a bit more dignity. I’m not claiming that they’re the worst people around, just that they aren’t good, and more importantly, aren’t particularly pleasant.
I ended up joining them because I found irresponsible assholes to be mildly more palatable than snobby assholes, and am now sticking around now to try to ensure the Patriarch’s sons don’t maintain power.
sighs The error’s back. My Aunt is the one who has been crowned, but the journal records the Protégé.
edited by Anne Auclair on 4/13/2016
I feel like I’m late to the party, and I waited too long to post here, in that the story and my perceptions of it are no longer fresh in my mind. I don’t remember everything I wanted to comment on about this story, but I figure I oughtta at least write what I remember of what I wanted to say here, before I forget all of it lol.
I enjoyed many parts of this story, especially that it all related to [spoiler]Kingeater’s Castle. I remember that place all too well from The Sunless Sea, and I think I must’ve looked like I had seen a ghost when I first spotted the name of that horrid place. The First Ragged King came back from Kingeater’s Castle with only a third of his crew? Well, gee fucking whiz, I wonder where the crew went? D^’:<
The only part I really didn’t like was the ending. I had chosen the protégé at the beginning. For the chase scene, I decided to tip over the soup cauldron/pot thing, to create a distraction while my protégé fled. After succeeding in the first challenge, which relied on the Reign of Absurdity quality… Was it absurdity? I can’t remember… this is what I meant about waiting too long lol. Well, I’m you know what I mean, whatever the other quality was, the one that was kinda opposite to Reign of Terror. )
Well, ANYWAY, after succeeding in the first challenge for the chase scene, I had a horrible string of bad luck, and I failed the next 5 or 6 50-60%+ challenges, at which point, I think I took some wound damage and something else to help my protégé escape from being cornered in a stable or something. Then that 14-year king asshat CHEATED and shot my man in the back.
Coming to the part that I had a problem with, I was presented with two choices. Either clobber that asshole in the back while he was distracted, OR "wait and see how this plays out." IIRC, it said something about "knowing that look" in my protégé’s eyes, and that he was holding something. I thought "OK, I’ll play this smart. I’ll see what trick my protege has up his sleeve, and then intervene if things go badly." I mean, even if things did go badly, death usually isn’t permanent in the Neath, so this would be a good test for my protege, to see how he would do on his own.
Frankly, I wasn’t expecting the fight to end so quickly, and I thought that waiting "to see how this plays out" would lead me to another decision after telling me how my protege’s tricky plan went. I mean, am I honestly expected to believe that the Patriarch just let my protege run away, (likely not very fast either, given that he was badly wounded and exhausted, nearly ready to collapse), ESPECIALLY when one would assume that the Patriarch either still had his rifle, or that he would have some kind of ranged weapon on him, be it a hidden pistol, or one of the weapons that the other stags at the feast had. I mean, he was stabbed in the knee, right? (also, how do you even stab someone in the knee? I would think that it would be tough with all that bone, especially the kneecap)
Basically, what I’m trying to say is that the ending felt kinda rushed, for the reasons poorly highlighted above. It hurt that my protege asked me "where the bloody hell were you?!" or whatever, when I had meant to intervene after he stabbed the Patriarch or whatever. Although, he didn’t seem to hate my guts later when he said he was gonna leave for the surface. (which, btw, how does that work?? Does that mean that he’s gonna go up to the surface, bask in the sunlight, and die?)[/spoiler]
I hope this all makes some semblance of sense; I’m rather tired and I really should have eaten lunch by now. :/
EDITS: AHHH! I messed up the spoiler tags! Can you only have one spoiler section per post? Man oh man, I can’t believe I still haven’t figured out how most forums work with formatting and stuff. Damn it all! >:’(
edited by Natan on 4/13/2016
edited by Natan on 4/13/2016
edited by Natan on 4/13/2016
[quote=Anne Auclair]sighs The error’s back. My Aunt is the one who has been crowned, but the journal records the Protégé.
edited by Anne Auclair on 4/13/2016[/quote]
Sent a bug report. Figure I might as well finish the story line as I already have a toe in. So far I’m enjoying it. What larks, what larks.