Too Much Romance (spoilers)

I’m sorry, but I have to complain. It’s the glut of romantic storylines. It’s on opportunity cards, storylets, even in Lodgings. I mean, I get that romance is emotional and dramatic and yada yada, but I feel like it’s sort of forced on me by virtue of the writing. The heiress and the mud man, the struggling artist/model, the honey addicts, the Affectionate/Quiet devils, tattooed spy, revolutionary firebrand…Like, can’t people have relationships that aren’t romantic? I think the thing that really triggered this gripe is the Nemesis storylet I just played, where it asked me who I’m avenging. I saw two options for romance. There were two for family as well, but neither option was the one I wanted, which was avenging a parent. sighs Oh, I also wanted an option to avenge a best friend, but I chose &quotBrother&quot as the closest option to what I wanted.

I guess I just don’t like having it assumed that I want to flirt with everyone I meet. The only solution is to not play those storylines, but that’s not feasible for a first character, IMO.

In the deepest matters of the Bazaar always look to love.

Most flirtatious options are either located in Veilgarden (a place where one’s &quotpersuasive talent&quot is engendered) or are simply minor alterations to already brief encounters. In the Shuttered Palace such liaisons simply provide a backdrop to the intrigues of the royal court.

Fallen London is, through and through, a story about love. What kind of love? All of them. Healthy love and unhealthy love - happy affairs and romantic tragedies. The entire reason that London was dragged a mile underground in the first place was love.

I don’t quite see where your argument is going, you have not listed a single feature that isn’t either avoidable or blandly acceptable.


edited by Owen Wulf on 7/12/2014

[li]
I’m not trying to argue, per se. It is merely an opinion. And acceptability or neutrality may be your stance, but for myself, it’s just kind of grating or it leaves me cold. But I guess romance is like humor. It’s impossible to reach everyone or do it in a way that will move everyone to emotion.

It’s just that with lines like &quotforcing a smile&quot or &quotenjoying her company,&quot I feel like I’m being told how I/my character feels, and that’s not acceptable to me. Never mind that romance isn’t necessarily the only way to be persuasive.

your relationship with the cheesemonger is somewhat intimate and complex… and you don’t get to lust for her or anything like that.

you can however kill her. the masters might consider that “romantic” in a way. no kiss-kiss, but yes bang-bang?

It’s not exactly easy to represent all possible ways in which a character can feel, especially in a game that has to rely on detailed text to be compelling. It’s not easy to write one character well, let alone all manner of possible characters. You only get full freedom of character determination if you’re actually writing the words yourself.

To a certain extent, it requires a bit of cognitive dissonance, a bit of explaining away, to have full control over a character in any RPG, just from the limitations of the medium. If it’s any comfort to you, there are non-romantic relationships that form the center of many stories here. The Four Friends (The Regretful Soldier, Repentant Forger, Wry Functionary, and Sardonic Music-Hall Singer) are probably the best known.

And like Owen said, the plethora of romantic possibilities ties back to the main theme of the world/game, though admittedly it does come as a bit of a surprise when you first realize just how central love is to the whole business.

As Serguma has already indicated, love is extremely important to the Bazaar for reasons you will doubtless discover on your own, should you continue to play. That’s part of the reason romantic storylets are common.[li]

If you like, you can pretend your character is manipulating the individual in question. Or you can just decide they’re non-canon relationships as far as you’re concerned.

Also, you can leave out many of these storylets without great much damage to your game. Though I would play through the story of the secular missionary and through that of the revolutionary firebrand, if I were you…

But that’s the thing. I don’t want my feelings assumed. I think it’s perfectly possible to explain how the NPCs feel, what the world is like, even what my character does - without going into the emotion behind it. Why can’t I simply be told that my character smiled or frowned or climbed a pipe or any manner of things and let me interpret why?

Fair enough. And the NPCs are quite well done, IMO.

shrugs I don’t know. Maybe I’ve been spoiled because with my disability, text RPGs are all I can really play. And while yes, I agree that to some extent, character fates are indeed in the control of the game masters, I shouldn’t have to do this picking and choosing. I understand what you mean, though. Because of how the game works with the numbers, probability, and having set storylines for areas/ambitions, there’s already a dissonance in that every player has theoretically experienced the same things. I’m used to games in which I can largely determine how my character reacts to stimuli and I can’t assume all players have experienced everything because of time zones and such. In such games, my characters inhabit a world, but the focus is on describing what the characters see or hear, etc and allowing players to make of that what they will. Sure, there are major storylines, too, but it’s more about describing what is done to the characters and leaving it open-ended.

That sounds interesting. I definitely want to stick around to see how that works.

Yeah. I think I’ll just expunge it from fanon. I guess the problem here for me is trying to reconcile an RP mindset versus a gamer mindset. The storylets for grinding skills/items don’t really matter from a gamer perspective.
edited by Taleria on 7/13/2014

As mentioned, there are various memorable npcs that aren’t pursued/involved in romantic storylines. I do want to mention, however, that with the Sardonic Music-Hall Singer there is an option for such a fling, and if you find amatonormative language off-putting you probably won’t like how it’s presented. A game can be thematically emphatic on romance, yes, without leaning on that bias. Unfortunately, such is the nature of relying heavily on euphemism to portray a certain class of liaison. (Recurringly, a tendency to refer to ‘education’ of some sort, but I digress.) Amatonormative phrases are commonplace, and, in talking around the subject, the writing stumbles into that.

Characterization of the player character… yeah, it’s a text game. One that likes to inject flavor and nuance and tends not to get into technical detail when it comes to description. What I find difficult to justify/avoid is the means of obtaining goods, even through item conversion. Can’t believe how often straitlaced so-and-so resorts to swiping this or that, but hey, the tutorial was about breaking out of jail. And, as it turns out, the story of the game is about love: dodging it, losing it, being horrified by what happens because of or to achieve it.

And that aspect only heightens during the Feast of the Exceptional Rose (nicely timed to coincide with Valentine’s). There was even an in-character survey question on love this year, where the platonic answer gets dismissed by the npc doing the asking. To be fair, that was during the Feast. But yeah.

Interestingly enough, the paucity of (late-game) spousal options stands out all the more due to the focus on romance. What, seduction happening left and right, but commitment essentially boils down to either-or? The recent allowance for player-to-player marriage definitely opens that up, and yet I find that the increase in social actions leaves me hoping for more, something categorically platonic or even inimical…like two-person K&C. One could argue that the current range of social interaction does permit such relationships, but the same could be said for romance. (Nursing someone else’s wounds, for one thing. Or dinner. Is that eating in or eating out?) Romantic partners even have special ‘seen with’ status. No such labels for potential best friends and nemeses. And definitely no marriage-level bonuses. So yeah, it’s lopsided.

Social actions aside, since they’re all really optional - the only unavoidable, or almost unavoidable, romancing that happens can be dispelled as flavor text, I think. As far as I know, it’s possible to pretend that one never succumbed to the charms of the Secular Missionary or the Revolutionary Firebrand. You can tell them both off at the end too. And steal their stuff.

Just as rampant thieving can be taken with a grain of salt, so too the rampant flirting? I have a character who usually tries to avoid both, and not always to great success. There’s enough content for me to traverse, although I do wish for more. Not that I’ve hit the content boundary yet. (Gotta pace it out!)

Like I said, I hope that the scope broadens for what’s possible. And there are way more petpanions than spouses, though that might be because of the effort put into writing courtship and whatnot. I hear player weddings are hell of a grind too, laden with juicy text, though I don’t begrudge them the wedding planning and would not expect to seeing anything similar implemented, even if an equivalent scenario could be contrived. (Jump through these hoops to earn the honor of…? Lack of recognition is sadly reflective of general society. Marriage has a cachet that other relationships don’t, even if the romantic element is relatively modern.) So far I’ve done without trying that part of the game. Maybe an alt of mine will eventually get there. But if he does, it’ll probably be to elope.

It’s actually my main character who steers clear of seduction when I don’t decide to flat out ignore some of the text. My other characters were off-shoots from the decision to characterize my main that way - a decision I made before I really got to know what Fallen London was like. Yes, trying to avoid romance means cordoning off whole sections of the game, but isn’t hitting every card and doing everything the game has to offer basically constructing a character who is crazily multi-talented and over-involved? Speaking of which, definitely take a look at this approach if you haven’t already. Personally, I try to spread some of the storylets between my characters. And initially, I used them for exploring the options on storylets that could only be played once per. Now, my main character is still slowly, incrementally exploring different areas, while someone else is amassing items and echoes and hoarding not spending, and the still-technically-a-bachelor-but-who-knows-how-things-are-going-at-this-point is eating up all my spare time constructing messages back and forth. Sorry, that was irrelevant. But it is useful to have supporting alts to try out the stuff that the first character hasn’t.

To summarize, I do agree with the general gist. The flavorful writing and the direction in which it leans. The choice of euphemism, with the underlying assumptions. A lot of it is up for interpretation, but there’s still the nudging and the overall sense of romance in the air.

I hope you enjoy the game despite all that. I did, and also the repetition of storylet-grinding has helped with ignoring any overtones purely through a &quotseen it a million times, clickety click click, now where’s my stuff&quot response. As for new content? With the exception of the Exceptional Rose business (which was back in February/March anyway) it doesn’t look like romance will feature heavily, at least not on the surface.

I’m less focused on the romantic storylets, myself. However, what is frustrating is when your character has a spouse–yet the cards keep showing up. And showing up. And…

Well, there was the House of Chimes. There were a pair of great storylines in there, but er… without going into specifics, part of it made me feel like I was paying for access to a certain form of rentable room.
edited by dorianfoster on 7/16/2014

If those cards are bothering you, you can choose to completely eliminate them from the deck. It’s the stat challenge. I only kept the jewel thief because I wanted a reliable source of diamonds.

Interesting tidbit about the House of Chimes. Will keep an eye out if I ever visit.

I took that to mean even the cards that are now part of the City Vices group, which requires a change of address to avoid.

The jewel thief and the model’s second card each do have two methods of being flushed out from the deck, but, again, the accompanying text is not to everyone’s taste. Ignoring the text is more than doable, and yet…

I don’t think it’ll come back to bite me, but I hesitate to get rid of them like a spurned lover, or be rid of them in any way suggesting a romantic entanglement. At least in the case of the jewel thief. He’s the only one that pesters my main. As for the model and the artist, getting involved with them is the one decision I regret most, including that time I misclicked and sold my character’s soul through a lodgings card. Didn’t realize these love interests would haunt us to the end! Not even marriage will make them disappear? It’s a good thing I skipped out on a lot of the early Persuasive storylets for my main account.

I guess a way to look at it is that having those cards clutter up the opportunity deck is a small penalty to romance. Although, avoiding entanglements will still eventually bring about the jewel thief’s card…which can be removed from the deck but it’s just strange how a prior acquaintance is supposed between him and the player character regardless of whether anything happened in Veilgarden. Or maybe the thief’s being presumptive. Who knows.

Of course, the game also insists that I decide on whatever happened to an aunt of mine even if I did avoid writing a letter to her in the first place. There will always be unwanted cards in the deck.

Ugh. I think I am going to throw a hissy fit the next time I see that struggling artist’s card. No one likes someone who keeps begging you for money. Just wish the text to get rid of him didn’t sound so…well…whiny. There should be a “good riddance” option.

As for the jewel thief…Honestly, that’s the one romance that I liked. So far, anyway. Don’t want to get rid of him just yet. He’s irresponsible, but it’s not like he’s any consideration for marriage, so I’m happy to meet once in a while and have a good time.

Haven’t seen that aunt’s card since she came to the Neath, so no opinion yet on that one.

[quote=Dorian Foster]I’m less focused on the romantic storylets, myself. However, what is frustrating is when your character has a spouse–yet the cards keep showing up. And showing up. And…

Well, there was the House of Chimes. There were a pair of great storylines in there, but er… without going into specifics, part of it made me feel like I was paying for access to a certain form of rentable room.
edited by dorianfoster on 7/16/2014[/quote]

I would like to chime in and say that I shouldn’t like romantic options to be taken out for all married PCs – polyamory, free love, and open marriage are all things I like to play, that are made impossible in most narrative games. But being able to go ‘no, sorry, I’m monogamous’ and not be hassled about it again would be a fine compromise.

Speaking of free love, is there a cap on the Seen With quality? Aside from the maximum number of acquaintances anyone can have.

[quote=Taleria]it’s not like he’s any consideration for marriage[/quote]Sure about that?

[quote]Haven’t seen that aunt’s card since she came to the Neath, so no opinion yet on that one.[/quote]The deal with the aunt is, I think, that the opportunity deck will remind you of her now and then no matter what her status - whether you brought her, lost her, sent her back from whence she came. Level past the initial write-a-letter, and the game will ask you to reminisce, allowing you to jump to the conclusion (or mid/starting point, depending on how you look at it) of the story. Unlike our romantic involvements, this is one relation whose portion of deck clutter doesn’t vary, except in whatever amount the random generator decides. As dear Auntie’s presence in the deck is ubiquitous no matter what, i.e. isn’t in that way affected by player choice, I’m not much bothered even if I would prefer that one third of my characters not have any aunt at all.

I could be wrong about that. (Someone please tell me how to get rid of this mention of a non-existent aunt!)

Yeah, I was kind of annoyed about the Aunt storyline, though I guess it’s one of those things that can just be ignored for RP purposes.

About the jewel thief, now I’m intrigued. Still not sure he’d be a good candidate for marriage in terms of story, but you’ve definitely piqued my curiosity.

If those cards are bothering you, you can choose to completely eliminate them from the deck. It’s the stat challenge. I only kept the jewel thief because I wanted a reliable source of diamonds.[/quote]

I haven’t figured out how to get rid of the ‘kept man’ one. How can I do so?

The House of Chimes one still makes me sad. I was interested, but…yes, after a while it felt like you were just paying for access to a private room, as it were. That isn’t a bad option for some; I just was not interested.

[quote=theodor_gylden][quote=Dorian Foster]I’m less focused on the romantic storylets, myself. However, what is frustrating is when your character has a spouse–yet the cards keep showing up. And showing up. And…

Well, there was the House of Chimes. There were a pair of great storylines in there, but er… without going into specifics, part of it made me feel like I was paying for access to a certain form of rentable room.
edited by dorianfoster on 7/16/2014[/quote]

I would like to chime in and say that I shouldn’t like romantic options to be taken out for all married PCs – polyamory, free love, and open marriage are all things I like to play, that are made impossible in most narrative games. But being able to go ‘no, sorry, I’m monogamous’ and not be hassled about it again would be a fine compromise.[/quote]

It would be. No one’s advocating removing the free love options, by the way.

I’m merely tired of them. Repeating, ‘not interested, not interested, not interested’ gets monotonous! I feel like plastering a sign to my chest and parading around with a little flag. And then I feel sort of creeped out, because they obviously are stalking me, just for a view of my beauteous stockings, while leaving behind writing composed of sorrow-spider webbings and telling me about our forever-futures as revealed by the readings of sacred mushroom spore tea.

Ahem.

One must reside at remote lodgings, I think. To avoid all City Vices opportunity cards. Don’t think it’s possible to be rid of him specifically. Hindsight is…yeah.