I find the candidates very interestng this year, but their most interesting bits are quite more well-disguised. Virginia might well win because her roguish nature (not her true self as it seems) is well-entrenched in the game from before. Few know about Ms Plenty’s Seeker past, or the true meaning of Soshana’s predictions - and what her ‘love is the answer’ really means. Previous candidates were well-known and interesting even before the elections. As an endgame player I do not mind at all to be honest; some side characters like Soshana needed more fleshing out. Oh well, all the more reason for the elections to leave something behind!
So on every other candidate card I’ve seen, this election and last, asking about their platform grants an extraordinary implication, and the option to harrass them likewise gives a value of 2.5 echoes. However, I just got my first Virginia card, and asking her about her platform gave me a single intriguing snippet worth 20p. That doesn’t seem right.
The short answer is that the doom she predicts is basically the same thing that we know has happened to the first, second, third, and fourth cities, and will likely also happen to London if there is a sixth. [quote=direful dreams] "She sees cities a aflame and falling to dust. She sees tides of larce. She sees the french falling in. She sees Berlin and Vienna, St Petersburg"[/quote] The "cities aflame and falling to dust" and "tides of larce" is basically what happens to the previous city during the fall of the new one, while the reference to "the french falling in" is because Paris is the most probable candidate for the sixth city. Her solution is that "London requires psychic protection" and she wants "the Ministry"(Likely the Ministry of Public Decency) to get involved.
edited by thefantodayhtml on 7/19/2019
Psmyth again - Admittedly, just HOW Mr.Pages serves her vision is hard to infer - and, despite my own few commissions from him, as a freelance agent, i do fret at the Ministry’s possible excesses of censor, in serving sanity - Thus - in my heartfelt support, i DO hope she may graciously enlighten us further … -:- "D" -:-
edited by Doctor_Static on 7/19/2019
I am just amused all three candidates are people Caroline Blackmailed in the past.
Psmyth chuckles, in passing again :: Ahhh - Worthy Candidates, all! . . . B.M. materiel seems a good end-game, or pre-emptive, Campaigning resource, indeed! Something best kept up the sleeve, 'til needful. -:- Drazzle -:-
FWIW here is the link to my spreadsheet - shamelessly cribbed from Skinnyman. I’ve collated all the card options from my own and others’ actions - this was before I knew about the Reddit thread so it’s possibly redundant. Spoiler warnings obviously!
I have an appalling memory so I’ll add the poll results as they come up too, for posterity.
It’s interesting to me that nobody can find any points against Virginia, other then "she is a devil." The only other argument I’ve seen is "her plan is to increase our health, for the benefit of the Brass Embassy." This is possible, but all signs say she and the Embassy simply are not working together. If she’s working to their benefit, it could only be a matter of charity on her part, and that just doesn’t seem to fit.
Besides, what does it matter what her motives are? She wants to better our health; does it matter why?
Something tells me Madame Shoshana will wind up a sleeper star, possibly the winner. This disturbs me. Her platform is built out of her fraudulent divinations, and an ill omen that can only be averted by her election. I see no merit in her whatsoever, as an elected official.
I have some respect for Mrs. Plenty, as an ex-Seeker. I also feel great irritation toward her, as an EX-Seeker. Seeking aside, she likely has the most experience in managing things on a grander scale. She may be the candidate to achieve the most, if she set her mind to it. Only problem: her stated goal is "a moment of peace." If she were promising improvement comparable to Virginia’s promises, she may yet have my vote. But all that I’m seeing is a tired old woman who wants to sit idly by and make a little more money.
My vote will go to Virginia, unless something comes up to change my mind. More then anything, I do not want to see Shoshana in office. She has nothing to offer the people of London.
Yggdrasil “Drazzle” Fawlty Psmyth - seems i must chime in yet again - to quoth myself, a page later ::
-:- Virgina may be being diabolicly truthful, but is likely thus planning mass eugenics, with her “fitness salon” - to improve average health by eliminating the most [or least?] vulnerable - Tsk. -:-
For my earlier fuller opine, on All Candidates - see prev. [page] :: http://community.failbettergames.com/topic27528-the-mayoral-election-.aspx?messageid=239527&Page=7#post239527
Vote Shoshana for Future and Fortune !
-:- Drazzle -:-
That’s enough for most! Aside from that, she’s tried to: swindle me, murder me several times, steal my work, and disrupt my expeditions; her main henchman has also robbed me. But the ‘devil’ part should be most disturbing, whether or not she is openly supported by the Embassy her motives and methods are embraced by the devils as a whole. Her whole platform is akin to a fox educating chickens on how to live healthy lives.
I don’t think she’ll be idle at all. If she wins her time in office will see an expansion to the Carnival, more jobs and opportunity for the carnies, and an increase in her influence across higher echelons of London society. There’s a hungry darkness at the heart of Miriam Plenty but her platform at least appears to be good old honest crime, nepotism, and corruption.
On the contrary I think Shosana’s the only one with London’s interests at heart. A fraud she may be, but she’s also a genuine clairvoyant. And in this particular case we know that she’s 100% bang on the money - apocalyptic doom approaches London. Whether or not she can do anything to avert it remains to be seen, but she’s the only one willing to talk openly about the end that awaits us.
This is equivalent to saying, "What does it matter that he’s a jerk, if he’s buying me a drink?" Well, considering the things one could put into a drink, or the way one could buy you enough drinks to, let us say, blunt the edge of one’s perception, or the fact that such a move can be the opening gambit in a confidence scheme, I think it matters very much. So here. Virginia’s promise to be "good for the soul" is trustworthy only so much as she herself is trustworthy. Otherwise, you’re very likely to get more (and less) than you bargained for.
The means she has given to accomplish her "moment’s peace" are neither idle nor inexpensive. Just the task of convincing the Khanate and the Presbyterate to bugger off for a while seems Herculean. No, whatever happens to her bottom line, I’m reasonably sure Mrs. Plenty will be doing very little idle sitting.
I have looked at M. dePoisson’s spreadsheet, and the more I look, the less difference I see in the candidates, and their prescriptions for London. So to me it comes down to character, and I think Mrs. Plenty is the strongest and most reliable character of the three. She still has my vote.
I have to agree - to me she’s a bit like Sybil Trelawney from Harry Potter: a fraud for most of the time, but occasionally she’ll utter the truthful (and absolutely crucial) profecy.
She’s not remotely as memorable a character as Virginia, which makes me think the latter will win. Yet I’m really curious to know what Mme Shoshana is planning in order to give London "psychic protection"… I hope that plot doesn’t get lost if she’s not elected!
edited by Phèdre Delaunay on 7/20/2019
Was that ever in question? I mean, you’ve been agitating to get Mrs. Plenty on the ballot for, like, three years now. :)
One thing that should probably be said is that this may be the most balanced slate of candidates we’ve had yet. There was a lot of noise with Sinning Jenny (and even more with Feducci) that London mayoral races were runaway affairs. Last year, the Contrarian won less because of his own appeal and more because many of us were desperate to keep the other two out of office. This year, though there’s certainly more heat around Virginia than the other two, things do seem more evenly balanced than we’ve yet seen.
Not, of course, that it’s perfectly balanced (or should be). I still see this election polarized by Virginia, and the anti-Virginia lobby split between two relatively even candidates. In that regard, it’s much like the Feducci-DTC-Implacable Detective race, except that both the DTC and the Detective stirred up a great deal of genuine enthusiasm. I don’t see much enthusiasm for either Mrs. Plenty or Mme Shoshana, which is bad for their chances. Then again, I haven’t seen many really passionate backers of Virginia. The bulk of the conversation seems to be devoted, not to the merits of each candidate, but to how my candidate is not as bad as the other two.
I can’t say that’s an ideal position for an election, but it’s certainly an interesting one.
[quote=Siankan]
This is equivalent to saying, "What does it matter that he’s a jerk, if he’s buying me a drink?" Well, considering the things one could put into a drink, or the way one could buy you enough drinks to, let us say, blunt the edge of one’s perception, or the fact that such a move can be the opening gambit in a confidence scheme, I think it matters very much. So here. Virginia’s promise to be "good for the soul" is trustworthy only so much as she herself is trustworthy. Otherwise, you’re very likely to get more (and less) than you bargained for.[/quote]
That is a false equivalency. It’s closer to saying "What does it matter if she’s a jerk, if she’s willing to pay my medical expenses?" A drink is cheap, and could contain anything; better healthcare is valuable, and I can’t see any way to tamper with it.
Someone will have to fact-check this one for me: what determines the value of a soul? My understanding is that it’s basically intelligence and richness of life. But is it possible to artificially increase the value of a soul, without doing any good to the owner? I suspect the answer is "no, that’s not possible," but I only know so much about this.
That’s enough for most! Aside from that, she’s tried to: swindle me, murder me several times, steal my work, and disrupt my expeditions; her main henchman has also robbed me. But the ‘devil’ part should be most disturbing, whether or not she is openly supported by the Embassy her motives and methods are embraced by the devils as a whole. Her whole platform is akin to a fox educating chickens on how to live healthy lives.[/quote]
If you asked me to name a mayoral candidate who never tried to hurt or cheat me, I don’t know that I could name one. The glim-collecting woman who made me this cane, perhaps?.. but she asked such a high price, I’d call that a cheat.
I tire of these blatant misrepresntations of Virginia’s character. She is a devil, that’s a fact. Devils deal in the importation of souls. That’s also a fact. Now have some other facts: the overwhelming majority of imported souls are done so legally. You may even be among those who’ve signed your soul away. (I’m not; I have particular need for my soul) Those souls not sold legally are the work of spirifiers, who work outside of the Brass Embassy and have no affiliations with them. Most spirifiers are human, in fact.
I’ll not sit idly and let people continue to paint every last devil as a soul-snatching boogeyman! If you wish to argue against Virginia, do so out of her merits and her promises, not the fact that she is not human. It’s blatant racism! Some of the kindest and most helpful people I’ve met have been devils!
[quote=asinineFlatfoot][quote=Siankan]
This is equivalent to saying, "What does it matter that he’s a jerk, if he’s buying me a drink?" Well, considering the things one could put into a drink, or the way one could buy you enough drinks to, let us say, blunt the edge of one’s perception, or the fact that such a move can be the opening gambit in a confidence scheme, I think it matters very much. So here. Virginia’s promise to be "good for the soul" is trustworthy only so much as she herself is trustworthy. Otherwise, you’re very likely to get more (and less) than you bargained for.[/quote]
That is a false equivalency. It’s closer to saying "What does it matter if she’s a jerk, if she’s willing to pay my medical expenses?" A drink is cheap, and could contain anything; better healthcare is valuable, and I can’t see any way to tamper with it.[/quote]
First: No, it is not. Indeed, one can draw very direct parallels.
Second: Virginia is not proposing healthcare. She is offering spas, not hospitals; calisthenics, not surgery. Does a personal trainer benefit your health? Yes, but you don’t call him a healthcare professional.
Third: If you do not see how a malevolent will can tamper with medical care, I’m guessing you haven’t watched that many horror movies. If anything, actual healthcare would be more dangerous than what Virginia is proposing; one can do a great many things will pills and syringes, and get people to agree to a great many things if it’s suggested for "your health’s sake."
This is, however, getting us down a rabbit trail. The best model we have for what Virginia wants to do is Carillon. (It is indeed possible that Virginia herself becomes the Presiding Deviless.) Thus, the best way of discussing its value or danger to London is to consider that institution.
If you choose to free your Brilliant Souls "in exchange for secrets," you get the following text: "Perhaps the requirement for this level of soul is to have lived a life of startling unpleasantness. You stop writing when the shivers get too much." So yes, I think one can fairly say that an increase in a soul’s worth does not necessarily involve "doing any good to the owner."
[quote=Siankan][quote=asinineFlatfoot]
That is a false equivalency. It’s closer to saying "What does it matter if she’s a jerk, if she’s willing to pay my medical expenses?" A drink is cheap, and could contain anything; better healthcare is valuable, and I can’t see any way to tamper with it.[/quote]
First: No, it is not. Indeed, one can draw very direct parallels.
Second: Virginia is not proposing healthcare. She is offering spas, not hospitals; calisthenics, not surgery. Does a personal trainer benefit your health? Yes, but you don’t call him a healthcare professional.
Third: If you do not see how a malevolent will can tamper with medical care, I’m guessing you haven’t watched that many horror movies. If anything, actual healthcare would be more dangerous than what Virginia is proposing; one can do a great many things will pills and syringes, and get people to agree to a great many things if it’s suggested for "your health’s sake."[/quote]
You are a kung-fu master of the false equivalency fallacy. Let’s do away with these pointless comparisons; they’re simply throwing us off the mark.
You say Virginia is offering spas, calisthenics. Things to put our minds and souls at ease. It’s no healthcare, but we don’t stay dead, down here, so literal healthcare isn’t in great need; but wounds on the mind and soul stay forever. If she’s willing to make life more comfortable for us? If she can offer things to make it easier to sleep at night? Then I, for one, will be thrilled to have her as Mayor.
Carillon? I’m not familiar. Is that one of the former mayoral candidates?
Ah yes, Brilliant Souls for Tales of Terror. I’ve done this many times to gain Tales in search of the Fidgeting Writer.
It’s certainly one hypothesis that a life of thorough and complete misery is a way to augment your soul. But it’s only a hypothesis, and assuming it’s accurate, is that the only way? Could not a soul be made more brilliant by living a wondrous, charmed life?
If Virginia takes to subjecting all of London to horrendous atrocities in the name of changing our souls, I should think she’d be on the fast track to impeachment. And if there’s another way to get what she wants, besides atrocities, I expect she’d choose the subtler, less harmful route.
That’s a specious argument! If something is legal it is of course done legally, by definition. If murder were legal, the overwhelming majority of murders would be legal.
The Brass Embassy buys from these "illegal" spirifiers. You see them do it in the Ladybones Soul Trade storyline. The police end up raiding one of these warehouses. Devils aren’t choosy on where their souls come from.
Also, when you attend a Brass Embassy party during the Feast of the Rose, the Devils try and drug you into signing your soul away. So they’re clearly not above taking souls without consent.
That’s a specious argument! If something is legal it is of course done legally, by definition. If murder were legal, the overwhelming majority of murders would be legal.[/quote]
To clarify: when the Brass Embassy acquires a soul, it’s generally done by approaching somebody and making a formal request. They ask for consent. They don’t go around stealing souls from people without permission.
The Brass Embassy buys from these "illegal" spirifiers. You see them do it in the Ladybones Soul Trade storyline. The police end up raiding one of these warehouses. Devils aren’t choosy on where their souls come from.[/quote]
That is not relevant. The point is, devils and their soul trade are not dangerous. The existence of spirifiers does not invalidate this point.
There will be unscrupulous members of any organization. It’s hasty generalization to say that they are all unscrupulous. Have you dealt with the Infernal Sommelier? He’s a much better representative for the Embassy. (who, I remind you, Virginia is not associated with)