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The Game of Knife and Candle Messages in this topic - RSS

Ryan Martin
Ryan Martin
Posts: 7

3/23/2013
Can it be? Underground Leagues of the Great Game, and we the champions of the prior Season were not informed? I shall have to present Mr. Irons with the tongues of his three favorite servants! Presuming he has any favorites, that is. Their tongues would have been best served speaking to those who should have been notified in advance, and not in whatever other trivial enterprise to which they have been put!

Bollinger! Fetch the Ravenglass. The long one. Melissa! Be a dear and have Juno's claws sharpened. Tonight, we hunt!

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Diptych
Diptych
Administrator
Posts: 3493

4/22/2013
Alexis Kennedy wrote:


No indeed! It's an acrostic.


WRDJOTLBTDCDGEADWLMVISMBMLJMAFMCRRBDNTCNKBMCSHADRLDMSDHSDDGREDAJTLS?

We ready duellists, joined on the London battlegrounds, to despoil candles dire. Given each a dagger, which luck may visit into shrouded malefactors. Blades, marked like Jack's memories, arrive from masked couriers regularly. Rank Bronze, denoting net tokens, commonly now known by Master's census, should hide, all defences ready. Losses demonstrate martial strength doesn't hold should different dangers generate risk each day. A just termination, lucky sods.

Something like that?

--
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David
David
Posts: 79

4/15/2013
Owen Wulf wrote:
K&C Tip:

- If you find yourself low on tokens (1-2) and are under heavy pressure simply head out to Zee on your boat - no one can attack you outside Fallen London.


Incidentally, I wish some sort of exception were made for people who have > 4 tokens, and who have attacked you in the last 24 hours. The number of people attacking me with perceived impunity, then retreating to safety, is on the rise - and while not yet alarming it is a worrying trend. Besides, there's little that amuses me more than the idea of bursting forth from their own ship's hold, stabbing them, then diving overboard to be picked up by my own waiting ship. Except, perhaps, dropping silently from my carefully concealed crevice in the amber to ambush them while surrounded by curious tentacled onlookers. In other words I would love an option for attacks "where they least suspect it" even if they had additional costs in terms of bribes or supplies.
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Alexis Kennedy
Alexis Kennedy
Posts: 1374

4/26/2013
travellersside wrote:

quite funny.... not as good an idea as it seems... far too hard... nearly empty... screwed over for nothing.



Hi again travellerside! Always a pleasure to have you cursing at me. Based on your past comments I can guarantee that you won't enjoy the Moon League, even when it's no longer in early alpha, and you should definitely stay away.
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Alexis Kennedy
Alexis Kennedy
Posts: 1374

4/29/2013
Some of the latest changes:


- The Bronze League is gone! It has fulfilled its initial purpose. Former Bronze League members should log in now to receive recognition of their efforts. Intrepid Moon League explorers have also received a little something.
- Players may move freely between the Iron and Moon Leagues, but their Form is reset in each case.
- The Moon League now permits players to attack only once they've made two Moves. (Before that point, they can withdraw from the match.)
- Players now take turns to make Moves (but can still attack at any time after the first two Moves: this is to discourage lengthy stalemates and deal with drop-outs)
- Moves have a bonus of +10, rather than +5.
- Sponsorships, in case you hadn't noticed, are live. Moon League players with a Sponsorship will receive additional rewards after a hunt.
- Moon League players who lose all their Iron Knife Tokens will no longer be thrown out of the Game.

The Game will continue to evolve, but the key division is now between the Iron League (simple, casual, melee) and the Moon League (more complex, more engaged, duels). Future Leagues will likely fall one side or another of this boundary.


Thanks for all your feedback, bug reports and whatnot: much appreciated.
edited by Alexis on 4/29/2013
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Finvara
Finvara
Posts: 430

4/29/2013
Alexis, you beautiful bastard, thank you for all of your ongoing hard work. This most recent incarnation of K&C only gets more and more enjoyable as it evolves.

--
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Dolan
Dolan
Posts: 296

6/2/2013
It makes sense in the Iron League when it was just one stat check and, considering the attacker always chooses their best stat and the defender doesn't even see it coming, introducing an element of chance into it makes it less straightforward. However, in the Moon League there's plenty of strategy and both sides have plenty of time to prepare, so really the emphasis ought to be much more on proper planning - as it stands, all of that leadup to the final conflict is most often just both sides quibbling over which gets a slight advantage.

In short, there's so much emphasis on feints and gambits and general strategy in the Moon League that I think that it's that aspect that ought to essentially determine the duel. Unless both sides are very close, I think Moon League duels ought to be all but decided before the dice are rolled.
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NiteBrite
NiteBrite
Posts: 1019

6/8/2013
The heavy luck element is brutal and completely undermines the purpose of dueling. It does make good sense in the iron league but not on the moon.

Part of the draw of knife and candle in general was the constant state of flux. Even if it wasn't a balanced change the fact that things were changing every week kept people on their toes. That and there was a lot of new content. Without those two elements, I fear much of the initial enthusiasm has bleed out of the game over time.

The third major problem is seeing opponents. After talking about my dueling dry spell yesterday, I got several messages from people looking to duel me. But exactly zero of those duels happened because despite all of us being in the moon league, having forms, not being in a duel currently, having no outstanding duel invites to/from us, and all of us being in our lodgings (we were using shadowy loitering for messages) we still could not see each other as available targets for duels.

I have the vast number of moon league players added to my friends list, but when I go to challenge someone, I can never see more than like 60 out of like 300 players as available, and I imagine they probably can't see me either since the few I've talked to cannot. Plus I have a few specific friends who I know IRL who despite our best efforts have never been able to see each other for duels since like day one. And we really want to fight each other.

I am still looking for duels btw. Can anyone see me? Am I invisible? I know spacemarine9 has been invisible in the past. I remember that happening, so I know its a real possibility.

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Alexis Kennedy
Alexis Kennedy
Posts: 1374

4/11/2013
Spacemarine9 wrote:
are you even capable of giving a straight answer any more



Absolutely!
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Sara Hysaro
Sara Hysaro
Moderator
Posts: 4514

4/5/2013
It's a fun little myth. On an unrelated note, someone decided to take something I wore underneath of my clothing while I was wearing it, and as if that wasn't bad enough several people attempted to do the same afterwards! I've thought about retrieving it, but I'd rather not have to remain indefinitely across the Unterzee just to keep a single possession.

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Spacemarine9
Spacemarine9
Posts: 2234

4/15/2013
i do kind of wish there was an option to actually properly hide out and get a defensive bonus of some form because right now my options are "cheese it and hide out somewhere" which is lame or "lose all my tokens in the course of half an hour", which is lamer still. i wouldn't mind so much if i didn't have anything at stake, but having a bronze skull token has changed that
after losing six tokens in the space of ten minutes and very nearly getting wiped out of the game i don't really know what else i can do besides exploit a dumb thing until something changes
edited by Spacemarine9 on 4/15/2013

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Alexis Kennedy
Alexis Kennedy
Posts: 1374

4/11/2013
Spacemarine9 wrote:
eggs are still just omelettes in the making

will every attack get their own special flair eventually or is baroque just going to be the cool rad attack pattern for eggmasters and boxhavers only
or should i just shut up and wait and see



as always, my answer is 'Absolutely!'
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Spacemarine9
Spacemarine9
Posts: 2234

4/11/2013
are you even capable of giving a straight answer any more
also a seasoned candler sounds like something a snuffer would eat
edited by Spacemarine9 on 4/11/2013

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Alexis Kennedy
Alexis Kennedy
Posts: 1374

4/16/2013
friendshipranger wrote:
On a related note, do you guys consider going out to sea or hiding (ahem)...deeper, in the Neath, to temporarily avoid attacks, an exploit of sorts, or a tactical maneuver?



The latter. There are trade-offs; also NB that if someone follows you to Zee or Flute Street, they can still attack you. We may make K&C cross-setting, or continue to make sanctuary more textured or problematic, though.
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dragonridingsorceress
dragonridingsorceress
Posts: 622

4/26/2013
James McGivern wrote:
It seems unfair that if there are no available targets that you've essentially wasted the opportunity card. I wonder, is there a reason there is no way to back out of a card if you decide you don't want to, or indeed cannot, attack?


I was thinking something along those lines. I want to be able to see who is available to attack before I choose which type of attack I'm going to do.

--
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Alexis Kennedy
Alexis Kennedy
Posts: 1374

4/26/2013
Latest Bronze and Moon League members here:

http://about.failbettergames.com/knife-and-candle-faq/
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Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
Posts: 1372

4/23/2013
Have been away. As the person who started this particular round of soul-searching: yes, I understood that the conduct I objected to was legal, I just didn't think it was any FUN and thus was indeed attempting to influence community norms to make K&C something I actually enjoyed playing and accordingly stayed in, to the potential benefit of all.

(Thank you, James McGivern; your apology was gracious and more than generous.)

With regard to the bigger issue of K&C mechanics: I have long wished that Exceptional Friendship doubled the size of your card bank as well as your action bank. With the recent move to many more card-only storylines, this would be a far greater incentive for me to purchase Exceptional Friendship.

The other big change I would like to see to K&C has already been mentioned: more cards than just the four-card lodgings--since the new K&C doesn't test Dangerous or other grindable stats and doesn't risk your inventory, I see no reason to restrict it to high-level players. Or, if *more* cards are not desirable, then _different_ cards, again so as to allow more people to play.


[Edit: I see some of the new options do test stats, my mistake.]
[Edit 2: I misspoke when I implied that only four-card lodgings allow attacks; see downthread.]


edited by an_ocelot on 4/23/2013
edited by an_ocelot on 4/24/2013

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Alexis Kennedy
Alexis Kennedy
Posts: 1374

4/22/2013
Sir Frederick Tanah-Chook wrote:
Alexis Kennedy wrote:


No indeed! It's an acrostic.


WRDJOTLBTDCDGEADWLMVISMBMLJMAFMCRRBDNTCNKBMCSHADRLDMSDHSDDGREDAJTLS?

We ready duellists, joined on the London battlegrounds, to despoil candles dire. Given each a dagger, which luck may visit into shrouded malefactors. Blades, marked like Jack's memories, arrive from masked couriers regularly. Rank Bronze, denoting net tokens, commonly now known by Master's census, should hide, all defences ready. Losses demonstrate martial strength doesn't hold should different dangers generate risk each day. A just termination, lucky sods.

Something like that?


Sir Fred has obviously hacked my email and is hereby permabanned.
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Loon
Loon
Posts: 379

3/26/2013
Indeed there isn't! On a completely unrelated note, those who wish to participate in our little innocent and completely legal waxing and needling club should visit the thread in the Singing Mandrake.

--
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My alt Loogan Cuthoat can be found at http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Loogan~Cuthoat and welcomes all social actions bar cats and photographers.

My alt Ally Mooney can be found at http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Ally~Mooney and welcomes all social actions including patronage, though they are a bit confused by cats in boxes.
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Spacemarine9
Spacemarine9
Posts: 2234

4/20/2013
i just wish there was a consolation prize for losing streaks as well as winning streaks
"congrats you lost seven times in a row here's one token and a shiny medal"

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Alexis Kennedy
Alexis Kennedy
Posts: 1374

4/26/2013
Sir Frederick Tanah-Chook wrote:
I'm pretty sure that I've lost more opportunities to attack by trying to load up my friends list or people's profiles than I've actually launched successful attacks.



Yes, it's not ideal. We're looking at both content-based and UI solutions.
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Spacemarine9
Spacemarine9
Posts: 2234

4/26/2013
as the Moon League stands at the minute it doesn't even really seem all that worth it to bother with the stat boosts: the amount of cards it takes to get to 7 moves could easily be used to amass a swathe of murders rather than focusing on one single attack with only a small bonus for victory. it seems like it's most useful if you can use it while your target is sleeping or something so you can rack up a slightly better chance of winning, but with the stakes and rewards both set so low there's little incentive to even bother
i dunno i've tried using stat boosts a few times only to get cut off when the other person just steps in and straight up stabs me without using a boost at all. because of the massive stat variance between the Forms, you'll usually win if you just stick with your strongest stat and hope for the best.

i'm kinda tired i don't even know if i'm phrasing what i want to say clearly here. i really like the idea of the moon leagues but as they stand i don't know if it's worth the effort and the amount of stabcards it takes to actually make use of the different features

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Dolan
Dolan
Posts: 296

4/26/2013
Plus there's no guarantee you'll win even with a stat boost - I boosted one of my stats 3 times (to 115) and then attacked, only to lose anyway. My opponent was apparently offline and never made a move. Stat boosts definitely need to be more than 5 a pop, or confer some sort of secondary bonus, in order to be worthwhile.
edited by Dolan on 4/26/2013
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Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
Posts: 1372

5/1/2013
Also, in case there needed to be another vote in favor of an auto-generated K&C contact list that could be used only for playing K&C, here it is, as I watch those cute little eyes blink, and blink, and blink some more . . . as the system attempts to determine who, out of my extravagant contacts list, I may ship potential cat-boxes to.
edited by an_ocelot on 5/1/2013

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Theus
Theus
Posts: 311

5/3/2013
Dolan wrote:
There really needs to be a penalty for not responding to a move within a certain period of time (somewhere in the 12-24 hour range)...


I suspect that there is a small minority of players that check in less than every 12 hours and that balancing a form of gameplay slated to be rolled out to the full player base on this minority is a bad idea. It may be frustrating to the hardcore few who play this way, but the Moon league does not feel like the correct fit for this type of restriction.

Perhaps there may be a future League that will be for the small number of uber-dedicated players, but for now, it's probably best to pull back and glimpse the perspective that we are abnormal.players.

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Hamete
Hamete
Posts: 29

4/21/2013
Fhoenix wrote:
On one hand I agree with you, it would be nice to have some guaranteed attacks. On the other hand, you get stabbed so much now, imagine how much worse the barrage will be, once everybody has +1 attack and low level players become as competetive as high (by doing something about 4-card lodgings, as some people suggest)

As for unfettered, it all depends on how probable it is to win 7 (do we know it is seven?) times in a row in a 100 on 60 stat challenge. Could be pretty hard to get even with 250 Fate.

Perhaps you could have free attacks per day based on how often you have been attacked. This would give people a chance to defend themselves, without helping those who pile on.

As for unfettered, if we assume that these are Broad/0.5 checks, then you have an 83.3% chance of winning a single fight with a 100 attack vs. 60 defense. The probability of doing this seven times in a row is ~28%.

Note, of course, that 28% is the best case scenario, as it assumes that you get to make seven attacks and then go pick up your medal, all before anyone jumps in and makes an attack on you.
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Saharan
Saharan
Posts: 247

4/29/2013
It seems that possession of an Iron Token isn't required to be challenged to a Moon match. In fact, if you're at 0 tokens and hiding from the Committee (that is to say, ignoring the storylet that kicks you out) and get challenged, the forced storylet that kicks you out of the game goes away until the match ends.

Edit: Also, a suggestion. Many times now have I tried playing an attack card only to find a lack of available targets, resulting in a wasted card. Perhaps instead of bringing you to the attack storylet (which is only temporary), the attack cards could give you a quality that unlocks a pinned storylet available whenever? Obviously the pinned storylet would only be usable once per attack card, but it would be a much better solution than the one in place now.
edited by Saharan on 4/29/2013

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Nigel Overstreet
Nigel Overstreet
Posts: 1220

5/12/2013
Devoted_pupa wrote:
I was locked in a 3 v 1 yesterday.

Hedonism is increasing...

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Alexis Kennedy
Alexis Kennedy
Posts: 1374

5/13/2013
Saharan wrote:
short of everyone else following the very same logic


Exactly that. Obvious choice is obvious. I'll have the data on that soon, and I'll be able to see how much difference that makes.

Saharan wrote:
I don't see why obtaining the items of others is exclusively tied to Elusive, anyways.



  • You've identified a flaw in Knife-and-Candle's effeciveness as a realistic simulation... smile

    So, in-fiction, the Committee permits certain actions under certain circumstances. Out of fiction, I've deliberately made theft possible on only one stat to provide another axis along which choice is asymmetrical, and to enable anti-theft strategies.
  • +2 link
    Alexis Kennedy
    Alexis Kennedy
    Posts: 1374

    5/13/2013
    Hi all

    One point that may not have filtered through is that only Elusive duels / battles currently cause items to change hands (the action descriptions say as much). This will tweak the balance around stat choices in ways I'm looking forward to watching. It may change.

    Another is that you can now leave Knife-and-Candle, voluntarily or otherwise, without losing your K&C weapons. This is unlikely to change. It does mean that you can win a Waxwail Knife, leap out of the Game and be permanently safe from theft as long as you never rejoin K&C: of course that means you can never use its Savage bonus.

    Aspeon wrote:
    But always losing everything on a loss continues the problem with Prize Tokens where you know every failed attack will cost you a Prize Token, but you don't know if a successful one will gain you one.



    There will eventually be different results on StoryNexus social acts for winner-initiator, winner-object, loser-target and loser-target, which will allow people to try a theft without risking losing their widgets: but it's not possible in the current framework. (EDIT: I mean, it will be at some point, we need to do some work first.)


    Someone made the point upthread (and edited it out? I now can't see it) that the Moon League isn't as good value, reward-per-action, as the Iron League. It's not meant to be, and it won't be, for reasons that long-time players of the game can probably guess. If you're not having fun in the Moon League, then don't play Moon League: it doesn't come with a minimum income guarantee. If I can fail to make this experiment fun, I'm not going to bribe people to play it.

  • edited by Alexis on 5/13/2013
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    lady ciel
    lady ciel
    Posts: 2548

    6/2/2013
    I am now an Assassin of Assassinssmile

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    Sorry RL means I am not a very active player at the moment. No social actions unless you are prepared to wait and definitely no sparring or other mult-action things.

    No Calling Cards or boxed cats please. Will take dupes on the affluent photographers. Other social invitations welcome. Parabolan Kittens usually available, send me an in-game social action saying you want one and I will get one to you as soon as possible.

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    Dolan
    Dolan
    Posts: 296

    6/2/2013
    Yeah, you can tip the odds, but in most duels you're probably not going to be able to get more than a 60-70% chance to win, and most times things will be closer than that. I've said it before, I think anything more than a ~30 point advantage ought to be an almost guaranteed victory, like 90%.
    edited by Dolan on 6/2/2013
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    Finvara
    Finvara
    Posts: 430

    5/13/2013
    Dolan wrote:
    I still think it needs some extra reward to set it apart from the Iron League. Not something to bring the cost-per-action ratio in line with the Iron League, but something altogether different that you can't get in the Iron League (and not just a basic Fallen London item either).



    The reward you're looking for is called peace of mind. It can also help with the "going to sleep and waking up without being ded" storyline.

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    Spacemarine9
    Spacemarine9
    Posts: 2234

    5/15/2013
    oh man heck Golden Duels. you need 3 killstreaks to fight one, and winning gives you the Assassin of Assassins quality. Interesting!!!

    also it seems like senses of urgency got nerfed back down to 1/3 days? slows the game down a bit for those who aren't swimming in stabcards, i guess. description still says 3/3days but i definitely only got 1
    edited by Spacemarine9 on 5/15/2013

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    bjorntfh
    bjorntfh
    Posts: 216

    5/16/2013
    So, a new level of distinction is available...

    Monstrous.

    It requires rank 3 in Assassin of Assassins... And 7 Prize tokens.

    Whelp, there's some work to do.
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    Dolan
    Dolan
    Posts: 296

    5/17/2013
    Michael Silbey wrote:
    I think Moon League now unfortunately favors the defender.

    Now that you can only attack when it's your turn, it's difficult to say for sure without seeing how it plays out across large numbers of duels (which is what I am sure Alexis is looking at right now). The defender does have an advantage in that they get the first move and get to attack first, but there are 4 defensive gambits to choose from that essentially give no benefit to the player who attacks first - the two that block savage and elusive, and the two that boost elusive and baroque to 300 but limit its use to defense. Add to the mix all the gear available and the fact that RNG can be a fickle mistress, and it's very hard to say for sure where the advantage (if any) lies right now.
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    NiteBrite
    NiteBrite
    Posts: 1019

    5/19/2013
    EDIT: I take it all back. I just won two duels as an initiator with a -40 stat disadvantage. The RNG is just as fickle for initiators as it is defenders.
    edited by NiteBrite on 5/19/2013

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    Anstruther Barron
    Anstruther Barron
    Posts: 92

    5/20/2013
    Waffles54 wrote:
    Want a mirror catch box? Try the list below, it contains players that had one and put it on their profiles. (I already stole Anstruther Barron's)
    edited by Waffles54 on 5/20/2013


    Expect vengeance...

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    Spacemarine9
    Spacemarine9
    Posts: 2234

    5/12/2013
    I'd guess each Order will have four different medals: Iron, Bronze, Silver and Gold ones. The last one could probably help you eke another reward out of your sponsor if it's +4 or +5. might need to use an exotica with it first
    i think the most interesting parts of the medals are the inscriptions, though. the stat boosts are ok but fairly trivial but i love me some Words i do

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    Dolan
    Dolan
    Posts: 296

    5/13/2013
    Aspeon wrote:
    Maybe instead of other rewards, you can steal one piece of fancy gear you don't already have? (Say there's an option "Steal a Knife of Lost Sky," which requires not having one. The opponent is only eligible if they do have one, so if they don't you can go back and choose a different reward. Though right now I think the "Locked in a Hunt" quality is reset before you choose rewards, making that technically tricky.)

  • I like this idea, except it would be more fair if you just got to choose one treasure and had to live with your choice, whether or not they had one. One option would be "exotica" where you steal one of each exotica that they have (assuming exotica ever do something useful in the Moon League...), another option for the shroud, each knife, etc. You could choose one of those instead of your usual sponsorship reward. That way your treasures would still be in danger, but you wouldn't just lose ALL of them because of one unlucky stat check.

    EDIT: It might also be cool if which treasure you stole was based on stats you had over 100, like the sponsorship rewards. With a high savage you'd steal a knife if they had one, with a high elusive you'd steal a shroud if they had one, with high baroque you'd steal a Brass Ring and one of each exotica. Say a minimum of 110 or something would let you try to steal from that category.

  • edited by Dolan on 5/13/2013
    +1 link
    Alexis Kennedy
    Alexis Kennedy
    Posts: 1374

    4/29/2013
    If someone's challenged you, you still need to add them to your friends list before you can attack/move against them.


    This is confusing, we know - so next patch we'll be auto-adding users to your list when they've invited you to something (which will make Iron League revenge easier too). You'll notice 'friends' starts being referred to as 'contacts', too, to reflect what it does more accurately.
    +1 link
    Finvara
    Finvara
    Posts: 430

    4/30/2013
    You knew what you were getting yourself into, Seeker. Take your lumps.

    --
    http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Professor~Varald
    +1 link
    Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
    Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
    Posts: 1372

    5/1/2013
    Feedback: if Moon League hunts become consensual, I will be very pleased, as I apparently have horrible luck at picking opponents who are actually AROUND. I ditched my first after 24 hours of no response; I'll give this one 36, but it's kind of feast or famine between the nothing-happening here and the WAY TOO MUCH of the Iron Leagues.

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    Devoted_pupa
    Devoted_pupa
    Posts: 103

    6/8/2013
    I have sent a bug report and Nite told me hers have been ignored. I don't remember seeing her nor Spacemarine9 in anything other han golden hunts.

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    +1 link
    NiteBrite
    NiteBrite
    Posts: 1019

    6/23/2013
    I've been spreading cautionary tales about this sort of thing for a while. I knew it was bound to happen eventually.

    Uniden, what I have heard is that you can end the duel by giving up your form. I've never had chance to test this so I can't say for certain it will work, but its either that or try retiring or dying. Devoted_pupa's idea of leaving the moon league won't work since you are locked into the moon league once you start a duel. Your final option if all else fails is to send a bug report and hope someone on the dev team has mercy on you and lets you out of the trapped forever in a duel condition.
    edited by NiteBrite on 6/23/2013

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    Dolan
    Dolan
    Posts: 296

    5/3/2013
    The amount of time is obviously subject to debate, but clearly there needs to be SOME kind of time limit. If you don't respond for 48 hours, why did you even join the Moon League in the first place?

    Also, it's possible people are checking in but just not checking their messages/noticing they've been challenged. Another change that might help is making it more obvious a duel has been initiated, say with a yellow action bar that displays on the story screen, or something of that nature.
    +1 link
    Zee!
    Zee!
    Posts: 96

    5/3/2013
    My 2 cents:

    Sometimes I miss checking Fallen London for a day or two. I get up, go to work, have a busy evening planned, and get home late/stay out the night and Fallen London doesn't cross my mind. Of course, I've also been on the flip side where I've been at home all night obsessively using Fallen London every 5-10 minutes, and in that context waiting 60 agonizing minutes for someone to make a move is annoying.

    But we all have lives and things come up. It can be frustrating when you're the person sitting at their computer waiting while the other person is in a different time zone, enjoying an evening with their constant companion. But that's life. smile

    Of course, if there's actually bugs in the system which are causing it to not register moves correctly / not informing the other person ... that's a whole different issue.
    +1 link
    Theus
    Theus
    Posts: 311

    5/3/2013
    Dawson wrote:
    Not at all. K&C is a multiplayer aspect of a single-player game. It's all fine and well to check in once a day or less if you're playing by yourself, but if you involve yourself in PvP it's not unreasonable to insist on timely participation.


    It's an asynchronous, social part of a browser game.
    The problem with that is the paradigm has really been set by Facebook/Zynga among a large portion of casual gamers. The expectation created by those games will be what is expected of others who follow.

    To be more precise: there should be carrots for frequent play, but not sticks for infrequent play. Infrequent players should be tempted to spend money to close some of the gaps between them and frequent players, but cutting them out completely with a "you must act within x hours" restriction is unwelcome within the paradigm.

    That's not to say it cannot be implemented. Paradigm breakers happen, but they go against the unwritten expectations players have, and are likely to fail unless they are spectacularly designed.

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    Finvara
    Finvara
    Posts: 430

    5/3/2013
    I don't want to go pop over to Iron. I'm in Moon because it's where I want to be.

    --
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    Aspeon
    Aspeon
    Posts: 311

    5/6/2013
    Maybe it's worth starting a Mandrake thread for Moon Leaguers who commit to be active.

    Alexis Kennedy wrote:
    We won't be mandating drop-outs if a player doesn't respond after 24 or 48 hours - the discussion upthread neatly demonstrates that one person's 'painfully slow' is another person's correspondence-chess speed.


  • I read that as "Correspondence chess" the first time, which would be something entirely different.

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    Alexis Kennedy
    Alexis Kennedy
    Posts: 1374

    5/7/2013
    As per the Twitter and Facebook streams, three new Gambits are now available.
    +1 link
    NiteBrite
    NiteBrite
    Posts: 1019

    5/10/2013
    At least the medals don't cost an exuberant amount of tokens to get back. Its just a little embarrassing. But yeah, I think I've lost more tokens and prize tokens to accidentally giving things up than I have in all my duels combined from day 1 of K&C. And I've been in a lot of duels. Truly these options are the most dangerous knife and candle opponents of all.

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    Spacemarine9
    Spacemarine9
    Posts: 2234

    4/26/2013
    additionally i'm not really sure the whole strategy element even works: the stats aren't rock/paper/scissors, they only work best against each other. so if you see someone boosting Baroque but Elusive is your main stat... you weren't going to attack them with baroque anyway and if they attack you there's not much you can do about it. If it IS your main stat, you're still going to attack with it anyway because it'll give you the best odds because it's your _highest stat_
    You could switch Forms to mix things up, but that'd just cost another attack card or a Candle that costs 2 tokens... so what do you really have to gain? with stabcards as rare as they are, you can't really afford to waste an opportunity on something that'll just tilt the odds slightly on one battle that comes down to a luck check in the end anyway


    i don't know i really like the idea of a solo dueling thing where you slowly work on trying getting the upper hand on a single opponent instead of worrying about being shanked by all comers because you stuck your head out of hiding for ten minutes, but as it is it seems like a waste of time to do anything other than just attack straight away or after making 2 moves at most. still, the moon leagues are of course really experimental and these are still early days yet so i'm hopeful it can all work out in the end. all manner of thing being well and all that
    edited by Spacemarine9 on 4/27/2013

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    Finvara
    Finvara
    Posts: 430

    4/27/2013
    You're missing the point of the strategy. This isn't Chess, my doves, this is Poker. Your moves are meant to be lies, and your attacks are meant to be more lies, and your motivation is a lie as well. You take moves to boost your intended attack stat only often enough that when you take moves to confuse them about what stat you'll attack with, they'll believe it. Do you have 100 Baroque? Raise Elusive three times, wait a few hours, raise it once more, then two savage. They're likely to be ripe for the plucking then. In the moon leagues you are fighting your opponent with your head more than with stats.

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    Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
    Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
    Posts: 1372

    4/27/2013
    Actually, I was deliberately trying to LOSE to raise my Baroque, and the RNG decided to screw both me and my opponent over! -- which was the *second* time in a row it happened!
    edited by an_ocelot on 4/27/2013

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    Anstruther Barron
    Anstruther Barron
    Posts: 92

    4/27/2013
    On a slightly separate note, I love this.
    Baroque Result wrote:
    You laid your plans as a spider spins, if that spider were also a chess-player, and perhaps a conductor of orchestras. And you snared...


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    Diptych
    Diptych
    Administrator
    Posts: 3493

    4/28/2013
    I'll be the first to admit that I play Fallen London more than most, but it seems like every time I log in, someone's started Hunting me, made their Moves and launched their attack, all in the space of moments, and it's only sheer blind luck if I happen to successfully defend myself. Heart's Hazard and the Shroom-Hopping are less of a gamble than this supposed game of patience and strategy.

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    Anstruther Barron
    Anstruther Barron
    Posts: 92

    4/26/2013
    I'm not sure I "get" the moon league yet. Essentially it seems like you have to play off the opportunity for better success with the chance for more stabbing. Maybe I'm just a little trigger happy but it seems sensible to go for the quick stab.

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    Lady Red
    Lady Red
    Posts: 517

    4/26/2013
    There is something strangely delightful about the phrase 'the quick stab' smile

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    Aspeon
    Aspeon
    Posts: 311

    4/26/2013
    Asclepius Unbound wrote:
    Apparently you can't have more than one Bronze / Moon token any more. Damn. Was going to use those as a token bank.


    As I hinted earlier, my theory about how to afford you-know-what was that returning a Bronze token might get you one Iron in return, uncapped. (It doesn't.) So turning in 27 bronze tokens means it could be yours for the low, low price of 239 tokens.

    (This may fall into "don't give the DM ideas" territory. But I'm sure whatever they've come up with is far more nefarious.)

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    http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Aspeon
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    David
    David
    Posts: 79

    4/20/2013
    Spacemarine9 wrote:
    i just wish there was a consolation prize for losing streaks as well as winning streaks
    "congrats you lost seven times in a row here's one token and a shiny medal"


    If Alexis implements this, I think it's only fair to warn you that I intend to race you to the bottom of the heap Given my current win/loss ratio, I suspect I can put up some fierce competition in that field. May the worst man... win?
    +1 link
    David
    David
    Posts: 79

    4/20/2013
    Lady Red wrote:
    I don't think that multiple attacks, because you keep losing, count as being poor form, haha - just endless embarrassment and woe.


    Endless embarrassment and woe? It's like middle school, with knives!
    +1 link
    Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
    Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
    Posts: 1372

    4/5/2013
    Is it too soon to talk about how a new thing that is not happening is going? I'm curious about other people's impressions, as this is my first time not-experiencing anything of the kind.

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    James McGivern
    James McGivern
    Posts: 43

    4/22/2013
    They will.
    +1 link
    Fhoenix
    Fhoenix
    Posts: 602

    4/23/2013
    Alexis Kennedy wrote:

    We're happy to sell Nex for convenience purposes (for instance, to stay in the game without having to wait for a friend to send you a token).

    I'd argue that is not just convenience. You are paying to retain your items, and your badge (which is worth 7 tokes). If the purpose of the game is to win those tokens and items, then not being able to lose them is surely one of the biggest advantages of all.

    Personally, I dislike the current incarnation of K&C for one reason: the use of opportunity cards as the main mechanic. And I don't mean the random nature of the cards.
    There are three problems with using cards exclusively for K&C:
    1)The size of the deck is 6. To play FL efficiently, you need to login every two or three hours to use your action points. To play K&C, you need to login every hour to draw those cards. Every ten minutes away from the game with a full hand, decrease your attack chances.
    2)The size of the hand is small. For me the main advantage of a big hand is not, that it can keep more cards, but that it makes drawing them faster. With 4-card hand and 6 cards, you need to click two times to draw cards (and 6 to discard...). With one free slot in the hand and 6 cards it takes six times to draw all the cards. Three times more clicking (and connecting to the server, and loading those images). Over the day it makes for a lot of waiting and a lot of time wasting.
    3)It takes more concentration to play cards, then to play storylets. When you draw, first, you need to look at the image of the card, to determine if it the right one. Then, if the image corresponds to one of the usefull cards, you need to hover over it to read its full name (stabs cards share images with non stabcards!!!! hovering over a small image to read the desription on a phone is not a trivial operation!!!) Finally, in general, you need to decide if the card is worth playing, worth keeping, or needs to be discarded (there is also a non zero chance that you will discard a useful card, when trying to discard a useless card, because the damn cards move to the left, when discarding, BUT move to the right, when drawing. This thing, btw, has baffled me for almost a yeah. Why can't the oldest card stay in place on the right, until I use it? If I am not discarding it, don't move it around the hand. Have you ever played cards? You don't move your aces around your hand each time you draw a new card!). Where was I? Oh yes, decisions. Decisions are bad, when there are a lot of them. There are countless studies that tell us: making a constant stream of small choices all the time, while choosing between 20 options, will tire you like nothing. With storylets you make a choice once: I will fight people in Watchmaker's Hill. Then go and do that. With cards you have to make lots of small decisions all the time. Should I watch that dream? Should I water my plant? Should I feed my plant some clergy? Should I help the Sardonic Music-Hall Singer? Should I increase my Hell connection? Preferably you decide all that without opening the actual card (as that would take even more time), just by looking at the picture. When you play for a year, you know the answer to all those questions by heart (Yes, No, Yes, No, it depends) and it turns into a memory exercise. But it's still tiring.

    Storynexus engine solves problems one and two btw, but it makes problem three much much worse.

    Rant over. Alexis, I hope you found that at least mildly useful.

    --
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    +1 link
    Richard
    Richard
    Posts: 304

    4/23/2013
    an_ocelot wrote:
    With regard to the bigger issue of K&C mechanics: I have long wished that Exceptional Friendship doubled the size of your card bank as well as your action bank. With the recent move to many more card-only storylines, this would be a far greater incentive for me to purchase Exceptional Friendship.

    ...and as a concrete example of that, I recently didn't renew my EF membership when it expired because I was in Polythreme and found I was constrained by cards rather than by actions. Whereas, if it gave me double the number of cards as well, then I'd just have renewed it without thinking like I normally do. So, there you go, Alexis! This has cost you like 80p or something.

    Cheers
    Richard

    PS. By the way - since changing one's username is so vigorously frowned on, I hereby give notice that I've changed mine to "Mr Puckeridge", to end a somewhat unprofessional situation where it was derived (by route of my Twitter ID) from the name of the company I run. Gold star to anyone who gets the reference.

    PPS. Of course, I'm only mentioning this because I know you can't attack me at the moment anyway ;-)
    +1 link
    James McGivern
    James McGivern
    Posts: 43

    4/24/2013
    One thing of note is that I've never seen "An implausible Penance" and I haven't seen Little Omen for days. I also have NO idea what you are referring to with "moods." How recent is that?

    I have long suspected that some cards are limited by player stats...
    +1 link
    Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
    Kade Carrion (an_ocelot)
    Posts: 1372

    4/24/2013
    New moods: http://community.failbettergames.com/topic1593-new-moods.aspx

    (I have seen a little omen and a dusty bookshop ONCE--total--since moods came in.)

    Implausible Penance is a Connected: Criminals card; I'm not sure if you need a certain amount to receive it.

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    Dolan
    Dolan
    Posts: 296

    4/26/2013
    So what exactly is the point to the Chrysalis Candles then? Maybe they should come with an additional bonus, like +5 to the main quality when you change form using them?
    edited by Dolan on 4/26/2013
    +1 link
    Spacemarine9
    Spacemarine9
    Posts: 2234

    4/26/2013
    apparently anything that's not a lodgings card is bugged w/r/t stabbings and doesn't give you the proper Moon League options or something

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    James McGivern
    James McGivern
    Posts: 43

    4/26/2013
    It seems unfair that if there are no available targets that you've essentially wasted the opportunity card. I wonder, is there a reason there is no way to back out of a card if you decide you don't want to, or indeed cannot, attack?

    I've wondered this before, but now, in the beginnings of the moon league (where battles can take a whole day or more) this could be quite a problem. Imagine the unlucky player losing 3 opp cards because every time they try to start a battle, their left without a partner.
    +1 link
    Dolan
    Dolan
    Posts: 296

    4/26/2013
    Give it some time, the Moon League is still brand new. The Bronze League was similar when it first came out too. If you don't want to wait for it to fill up, go back to the Bronze League and rejoin the Moon League later on.
    +1 link
    Diptych
    Diptych
    Administrator
    Posts: 3493

    4/26/2013
    I'm pretty sure that I've lost more opportunities to attack by trying to load up my friends list or people's profiles than I've actually launched successful attacks.

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    Corran
    Corran
    Posts: 401

    4/17/2013
    I have to say that I like the idea of the 'random target'. The problem with that is of course that tactics go out the window (I wonder how many people even look at Forms right now though).


    The current system with the Friends List is not ideal...

    I don't think many people like a super long list and adding people is tedious; two reasons why people might keep their lists on the short side and thus attack only a limited set of targets.

    One solution (which would require some programming) would be to use a totally new list for Knife and Candle. And, combining this with earlier suggestions for different leagues, you'd get a dropdown box auto-populated with only players reachable at that moment who are in the same league (say the first league is owning 1 - 10 tokens, the second 11 - 20, etc.) or whatever would be more appropriate to separate the leagues (as buying defense items lowers your tokens which makes tokens not the best choice).


    As to the number of attacks; personally I find even three attacks per day by the same person excessive but that's just my personal opinion. I'd be for a system where someone can't attack you after their first attack till you have attacked them back. When combined with the system above (and enough players in the game) you would not run out of targets soon. It would also be kind of a turtling strategy; you just defend and less and less people can attack you. Soon enough you'll have to attack though to get any progress. Thinking about all this; maybe the number of tokens should have been higher so you could award more for a succesful attack than for a succesful defense.


    Just my two iron tokens.

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    David Dunham
    David Dunham
    Posts: 13

    4/19/2013
    I’m not ashamed to say I’m totally mystified by this whole thing. OK, I have two tokens and a sense urgency. And I heard the rules and picked a form. But there is no opportunity to actually do anything. One of the lodging cards lets me waste it by trying to pick a friend, but none are eligible. So when do the opportunities come along that are alluded to in the rules?
    +1 link
    Aximillio
    Aximillio
    Posts: 1251

    4/20/2013
    Fhoenix wrote:
    BTW, somebody surely knows this. When you get a stabcard, and choose to attack, but then change your mind (like you find out, that there is nobody to stab), is it possible to go back and NOT lose the stabcard?

    No, but I think you can open up http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/su in a new tab, add some friends, the refresh the attack storylet with the story button.

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    Dawson
    Dawson
    Posts: 137

    4/11/2013
    Spacemarine9 wrote:
    are you even capable of giving a straight answer any more
    also a seasoned candler sounds like something a snuffer would eat
    edited by Spacemarine9 on 4/11/2013



    I laughed so hard at this that my sides are now in a slight amount of pain.

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    Spacemarine9
    Spacemarine9
    Posts: 2234

    4/11/2013
    i've basically had a bullseye on my head since the whole business has started and have been robbed and stabbed more times than i can count. you get used to losing about five tokens in the space of two hours eventually

    i guess i have a massive neon bullseye with "KICK ME" and "FREE TOKENS" written on it now though
    edited by Spacemarine9 on 4/11/2013

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    Spacemarine9
    Spacemarine9
    Posts: 2234

    4/15/2013
    i've mainly been stabbing alexis kennedy anyway he has like a million nex so its not like there's any major deal if he gets knocked out of the game
    the downside is that i occasionally discover i've volunteered for stabbing testing procedures without noticing
    unfortunately his token supply is limited so then i end up stabbing someone else instead: i try to mix it up so i don't stab the same person twice but then i have to run the hell away out of london again so i don't get massacred by another multi-attack barrage that puts me at 1 token


    edited by Spacemarine9 on 4/15/2013

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    Owen Wulf
    Owen Wulf
    Posts: 715

    4/15/2013
    Personally I find the whole system of attacking added friends ridiculous. I mean, if we were drawing from a registered pool of people to attack it would be all well and good but this is far too selective. We should just be given a target, not told who it is, pick our strategy and someone on the other side of the internet we didn't know will suddenly be fighting for his or her or it's life. For Heavens sake, we are simply adding people to our friends list just to stab them - does this seem wrong to anyone?

    Here is what I think should happen (& I'll add it to FL Suggestions)

    1. Make attacks on people random so we don't just grind the same person over and over.

    2. Make it so when you get a bronze medal or any medal above it you qualify to a higher league were you only contest with people there.

    3. Add some kind of permanent reward (clothes, weapons, rare materials) so that when we lose all our tokens we might just have fought hard enough to have something left over.

    4. Institute a system for people who are AFK or away for a length of time.

    5. For thefts of valuable exotica we should use rare items (Comprehensive Bribes, Blackmail Material, etc) to make a chanced roll at finding and taking the item in question.


    What do you guys think?
    edited by Owen Wulf on 4/15/2013
    edited by Owen Wulf on 4/15/2013

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    KatarinaNavane
    KatarinaNavane
    Posts: 462

    4/16/2013
    I think I have found myself at a distinct disadvantage from having posted on the front page of the joining thread, I am being attacked many many times a day. And can rarely pull enough cards to mount a significant counterattack, particularly against William Dawson, who I think earned the better part of his bronze skull Token beating up on yours truly.

    --
    Storynexus sn Katarina Navane.

    My art page (much of which is dark, Victorian, and/or full of tentacles): http://www.facebook.com/demonkittydesigns
    +1 link
    David
    David
    Posts: 79

    4/16/2013
    Lady Red wrote:
    How are you measuring success, Alexis, just out of interest - number of successful attacks?

    I think one thing that might make the game more fun would be if the opportunity to change your form was one of the K&C storylets over at Watchmaker's Hill - would make things much more interesting in terms of strategy!



    I'm curious how it is measured too - I would hope net successes since the last post.

    I don't think I would like the ability to change forms freely - then you would expect everyone to change forms immediately after attack, making form pretty random and meaningless. It'd be a toss of the dice with every attempt, and I enjoy what little strategy is currently available. On the other hand, if there was even one card with the opportunity to change form that didn't also include an option to attack, so that one could change forms without sacrificing a potential token, I think that would spice things up a bit.

    Spacemarine2*3 wrote:
    if I'm being a conduit for disaster there's less disaster for everybody else! livin on the edge



    This presumes disaster is a limited resource...
    +1 link
    Lady Red
    Lady Red
    Posts: 517

    4/16/2013
    Ah, but there's a difference between being attacked by lots of different people and being attacked all the time by one person, I think.

    I do kind of like the idea of a list of people who don't play fair, but then again.... nowhere in the rules of the game does it say that we have to play fair, does it? It would be better, I think, if we had the option of 'blocking' people we didn't want to play with - so I could put a user on my list, and s/he couldn't attack me, and I couldn't attack them either.

    --
    http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Lady~Red
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    Spacemarine9
    Spacemarine9
    Posts: 2234

    4/16/2013
    the dusty bookshop and little omen cards allow murders now but they are rare as all hells since the moods update

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    KatarinaNavane
    KatarinaNavane
    Posts: 462

    4/7/2013
    I'm still not entirely sure how the wins are calculated. Is it entirely based on the forms and the new stats? Are old stats taken into consideration? Is there a chance element? If it is just your form, it seems a bit rock-paper-scissors-ish. I hope it will become a bit more complex later on so there can be more strategy , or perhaps just a bit more transparent as to what is factored into wins and losses.

    --
    Storynexus sn Katarina Navane.

    My art page (much of which is dark, Victorian, and/or full of tentacles): http://www.facebook.com/demonkittydesigns
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    PetulantProcrastinator
    PetulantProcrastinator
    Posts: 75

    4/7/2013
    It's based on the new stats which are largely defined by the forms (things like Mirrorcatch boxes and Shroud's can alter the stats a little). I do believe there is a chance element (If you and your opponent have the same value of a stat then it's 50/50 who wins.) However the exact way it works out for other values is unknown.
    +1 link
    Spacemarine9
    Spacemarine9
    Posts: 2234

    4/7/2013
    yeah the amount of time and setup that would take for maybe one or two tokens isn't worth it really, given how rare they are even with all the fourcard lodgings. just fire off as many murders as you can and hope for the best, that's my modus operandi. even if it's not been amazingly successful all the time

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    Dawson
    Dawson
    Posts: 137

    4/8/2013
    It's not to say that it's a bad tactic. There's certainly something to be said for being able to make several actions at once, as I'm learning. Merely if one would rather tokens quickly, felt sure that they would succeed in their attacks, then I think it better to play as they come.

    It depends, I think, on who your opponents are.

    --
    http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/William~Dawson~III
    --
    +1 link
    Corran
    Corran
    Posts: 401

    4/8/2013
    I want 3,200 scraps a lot more than Knife & Candle wins so I'm using the lodgings cards for the former.

    I also find giving up Connections to be a waste so I only use the Soft-Hearted Widow card to attack.

    And to no great succes so far.

    It's hard to see how you could make Knife & Candle more than a game of rock, paper, shotgun. It would get rather involved with a multi-stage card/storylet to get some real strategy in.

    --
    My Fallen London profile
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    Spacemarine9
    Spacemarine9
    Posts: 2234

    4/10/2013
    A serious brush with Death will remove all of your tokens. Just nobody knows what a serious brush with Death IS, because you don't lose tokens on regular death.

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    Owen Wulf
    Owen Wulf
    Posts: 715

    4/11/2013
    I just don't get this game sometimes. Decided by a "committee" my buttocks, the chance to attack other players is ridiculously circumstantial. I had one guy attack me who I was unable to attack for days and figured we were allowed to fight again and used an attack card I had on standby. But he wasn't on my list of people who I could attack, nor was anyone I was willing to offend. I can't have 4 or 5 people gunning for me, I'll lose all my tokens that way. So I ended up wasting a good chance for no reason. What the bloody hell decides whether or not I can't stab a guy after he tries going after me?

    But yeah, it looks like I need to add more enemies to my friends list. Funny how that works isn't it?

    ---
    edited by Owen Wulf on 4/11/2013

    --
    Owen Wulf's Profile Lanzo Hoffman’s Profile Lukas Uller’s Profile
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    Diptych
    Diptych
    Administrator
    Posts: 3493

    4/11/2013
    You know what they say; if you want to make an omelette, you have to be prepared for the some of the eggs to contain furious serpents.

    ...that happens to everybody, right?

    (I was wondering precisely what Spacemarine9 was wondering!)

    --
    Sir Frederick, the Libertarian Esotericist. Lord Hubris, the Bloody Baron.
    Juniper Brown, the Ill-Fated Orphan. Esther Ellis-Hall, the Fashionable Fabian.
    +1 link
    Alexis Kennedy
    Alexis Kennedy
    Posts: 1374

    4/11/2013
    Lady Red wrote:
    Is it the upcoming marathon that is making you especially so?



    Absolutely!
    +1 link
    circe
    circe
    Posts: 435

    4/11/2013
    +2 Baroque on a loss - but that took me down to my last token so have taken myself out of London. Back in a day or two.

    --
    Lady Circe in Fallen London - http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Lady~Circe
    Adding no Suppers without prior arrangement, with only 5 Free Evenings a week and being a Patron I can't accept them all.
    No Affluent Photographer, Sharing Research with Another Scholar or Boxed Cats accepted. I will send Boxed Cats though. All other social actions welcome. Will help menaces, please be reasonable.
    +1 link
    PetulantProcrastinator
    PetulantProcrastinator
    Posts: 75

    4/11/2013
    The thing that I find most intriguing about this may well be swallowed up by Mr Iron, but I shall express it nonetheless.

    The person who first invited me to this non-existant club by giving me his non-existant token was... None other than Mr Iron himself.
    edited by PetulantProcrastinator on 4/11/2013
    +1 link
    Zeedee
    Zeedee
    Posts: 276

    4/11/2013
    What's his aim? To increase the iron trade by encouraging knife-wielding maniacs to purchase more knives to wield? To make sure said maniacs are so preoccupied with stabbing each other that they don't become nuisances to anyone else in the city? Is his ultimate goal to win the annual Fallen London Businessman and Good Samaritan awards?

    Meh, he's probably gonna throw the best murderers to Mr Eaten as a get-well fruit basket.

    --
    Please do not send me monstrous invitations tinged with the inks of the undernight or Boxed Cats. (I rotate my Starveling list, so it might take me a while to reach your name. I haven't forgotten anyone!)
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    PetulantProcrastinator
    PetulantProcrastinator
    Posts: 75

    4/12/2013
    My main questions were if he's starting them again why do it unofficial like and hush it up this time?
    +1 link
    CobaltMouse
    CobaltMouse
    Posts: 2

    4/13/2013
    I certainly think that I should be intrigued by an invitation to employ both bladed implements and illuminative wax, and would carefully examine any such invitation.
    +1 link
    Catherine Raymond
    Catherine Raymond
    Posts: 2518

    4/15/2013
    Owen Wulf wrote:
    K&C Tip:

    - If you find yourself low on tokens (1-2) and are under heavy pressure simply head out to Zee on your boat - no one can attack you outside Fallen London. But you will still continue to receive iron tokens from daily deliveries, so you can throw off attackers and recover Iron Tokens over time. Then just before entering London wait for your card & opportunity to stack to recover for maximum efficiency. You can either put out to Zee and choose to return to Fallen London or spend time visiting one of the Islands. As an added bonus you will also be grinding Zee-Voyager Experience which may be useful down the line.
    - Added Note: If you expect to be away from Fallen London for a while it is best you head out to Zee for your own protection. That way you won't find yourself paupered for tokens when you get back into the game.


    Great advice! Thanks.

    --
    Cathy Raymond
    http://fallenlondon.com/Profile/cathyr19355

    Catherine Raymond aka Mrs. Rykar Malkus http://fallenlondon.com/Profile/Catherine%20Raymond (Gone NORTH)
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    OPG
    OPG
    Posts: 387

    4/15/2013
    What about the Crowds of Spite/The Pickpocket's Promenade, or possibly the Empress' Court? At this point in time I am hardly an important figure in London, and thus I have no boat to call my own. I also assume that Places of Menace keep you out of the game, but I can't check for confirmation.

    (Also, I am not in K&C, just asking a question)

    --
    overpoweredginger, an irresistible, magnificent, midnight and sagacious gentleman.

    A Fallen London Roleplay Community exists. Contrary to popular belief, Richard Nixon is not involved.
    +1 link
    Spacemarine9
    Spacemarine9
    Posts: 2234

    4/15/2013
    attacking someone you know is egg and losing is the Worst Thing

    --
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