 Alexis Kennedy Posts: 1374
6/18/2013
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 Zeedee Posts: 276
6/28/2013
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My, my, that is one bootilicious teaser poster.
I appreciate and enjoy all this new mega fun and enlightening content, so thank you, FBG!
Sir Frederick Tanah-Chook wrote:
The Secret of Secrets? Does this refer to the Secretum Secretorum, said to be the correspondence sent by Aristotle to Alexander the Great? I note that this text includes mention of a cave in which was found the final resting place and mortal remains of Hermes Trismegistus (for whom the sealing of jars is named.) There, clasped in his dead fingers, was a tablet of emerald bearing exhortations of the Principle of Correspondence, followed by discussion of the relations between the Earth, the Sun and the Moon, and how the power of this understanding will bring to the bearer all the brightness of the world. This is the biggest wink-wink-elbow-nudge-wink I've ever gotten from you. I've seen the Emerald Tablet's contents referenced in multiple pieces of fiction, but I didn't bother to search for it till you mentioned it: http://www.sacred-texts.com/alc/emerald.htm
A translation: (from Idres Shah) 1) The truth, certainty, truest, without untruth. 2 )What is above is like what is below. What is below is like what is above. The miracle of unity is to be attained. 3) Everything is formed from the contemplation of unity, and all things come about from unity, by means of adaptation. 4) Its parents are the Sun and Moon. 5) It was borne by the wind and nurtured by the Earth. 6) Every wonder is from it 6a) and its power is complete. 7) Throw it upon earth, 7a) and earth will separate from fire. The impalbable separated from the palpable. 8) Through wisdom it rises slowly from the world to heaven. Then it descends to the world combining the power of the upper and the lower. 9 )Thus you will have the illumination of all the world, and darkness will disappear. 10) This is the power of all strength- it overcomes that which is delicate and penetrates through solids. 11a) This was the means of the creation of the world. 12) And in the future wonderful developements will be made, and this is the way. 13) I am Hermes the Threefold Sage, so named because I hold the three elements of all wisdom. 14) And thus ends the revelation of the work of the Sun.
Concerning verses #4-5, others have translated them (and the rest) differently: (from Jabir ibn Hayyan) 4) Its father is the Sun and its mother the Moon. 5) The Earth carried it in her belly, and the Wind nourished it in her belly,
(from Sigismund Bacstrom) 4) The father of that one only thing is the sun its mother is the moon, 5) the wind carries it in its belly; but its nourse is a spirituous earth.
(from Fulcanelli) 4) The Sun is the father, the Moon the mother; 5) the wind carried it in his belly. Earth is its nurse and its guardian.
Speculation (herein lie spoilers galore): Nadir is the diametric opposite of the zenith ("highest point") of a celestial sphere in astronomy. It's also a good way of saying "abyss" or "lowest point" literally and figuratively. The astronomy part is slightly worrying since that implies an area outside of the planet Earth. I saw the Nadirgate.png icon before I saw the narrative text, so I originally thought it to be the threshold of Hell...and I still do, actually, but that's not all. [spoiler]I also believe it's the Bazaar's hiding place for the child of the Sun and Moon, a wee baby star. The Neath is the "belly of the Wind", or the skull of a long dead Thunder God but tomayto tomahto. The Bazaar, the "Earth" representative, is the child's nurse. This should be intimately tied to the Bazaar's personal love story, its melancholy, its lacre, and its deep shames. Some of the Fourth City inhabitants had a clue: The language of the city of the Silver Tree, but obscured. Once you've realised that, an evening's work with magnifying glass and calculations is enough to yield - you think - the answer. THE LIGHT AT THE HEART IS THE DAUGHTER OF THE BAZAAR NEVER TO BE ACKNOWLEDGED. THE SHAMES ARE HERS TO RULE IS LIFE.
"IS" or "IN"? And how'd they know it's female? :P What sort of mystical divination arts did they use to discern its sex? That fact presses on my mind more than the one of there being a child.
The devils are in league with the Bazaar to obscure the child's existence and whereabouts. Their hunts in the Quarter are done to dissuade trespassers. The Forgotten Quarter is named the way it is because of its wistful air laced with amnesia courtesy of the Bazaar: Why is the Forgotten Quarter... forgotten? Memories of the place fade quickly. Even journals are easily misplaced, or so it seems.
The Eyeless Skulls were those Fourth City individuals who came closest to the truth, thus the Bazaar blinded them from it both physically and mentally. As the darkness overcame their eyes, so did it also shadow their minds. This is why you're dazed merely from owning the skull of such a person cursed by the Bazaar. Girl don't want you knowing of her troubled past with the Sun, so step off.
Have you ever traded souls with the Infernal Sommelier? Notice how he treats them as edible foodstuff? But who would dine on such fare? I surmise the devils of Hell bring the child its milk in the form of souls. Delicious, delicious souls. One spirifer who strayed seems to know of their connection: "Off the deep end. Stark raving. Souls are star-spores, she says. She'll grow her own star down in the Quarter. Be a shame to waste all that sift, eh?" And here you are, recovering the Demented Spirifer's soul-hoard. Those souls do sparkle.
Soul fuel is solar fuel. Whodathunkit?! Ah, this makes me want to collect some Coruscating Souls for my own pet star.
I shouldn't paste any fate-locked content here, but I do feel recent fate-locked content released in the Forgotten Quarter and Spite come together rather nicely. Specifically, the option where you poke at the drunk spirifer.
If there's a FL equivalent of the Emerald Tablet, it's probably a jade slab crafted by the people of the Fourth City. The Bazaar's love story is inscribed upon its surface through Correspondence sigils. Going back to the devils for a moment, we were first led to believe that they wanted the Forgotten Quarter to themselves for the sake of uncovering the Correspondence and its knowledge, so maybe they're after the Emerald Tablet or attempting its translation. Secret knowledge in the Neath acts as both power and currency, so it's double power where the Bazaar is concerned!
The Correspondence Stones are 7 in number. I first thought it was Mr Eaten's name, but I now doubt it. 7 is such a prolific number. If there are 7 great labyrinths in the Neath and 7 cities to be purchased, are there also 7 sub-levels to the Neath? If "What is above is like what is below. What is below is like what is above. The miracle of unity is to be attained.", then are there 7 stairs in heaven to reflect the Neath's 7 levels? In alchemy, there are classically 7 celestial spheres which link to 7 metals. In FL, I wonder what unity of the Above and Below produce. Could it be the mighty Philosopher's Stone or powers akin to it? Is that the "primal power, locked away in the Masters' vaults", the driving force behind the Marvellous?[/spoiler] Many alchemists regard the Emerald Tablet as a cryptic recipe for the Philosopher's Stone or an Elixir of Immortality, Isaac Newton included. His translation is also in the first link. Didja know he was an avid alchemist? http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/physics/newton-alchemist-newman.html (Transcript of PBS NOVA interview with Bill Newman, historian of science at Indiana University. It's educational and entertaining.)
An excerpt from aforementioned interview on the nature of codes and riddles in alchemy: Q: Did alchemists think that they were going to discover powers they wanted to keep for themselves? Is that why alchemy is so veiled in secret codes? A: That's certainly part of the reason. You find alchemical treatises that claim that knowledge of the philosophers' stone has to be kept secret, because if it gets out to the world that a particular alchemist has it, he'll be strangled in his bed to extract the secret.
Q: It seems that Newton also wanted to hold tight to his secrets—he never published any of his alchemical work. A: I think that, like other alchemists, he thought that alchemy promised tremendous control over the natural world. It would allow you to transmute virtually anything into anything else, not just lead into gold. There are other things, too, that probably were in Newton's mind. For example, alchemists realized that if the philosophers' stone were real and it got out to the public, it would ruin the gold standard. [laughter]
Q: I think what makes a lot of people think of alchemy as black magic is this bizarre language—phrases like "the Green Dragon" or the "menstrual blood of the sordid whore." A: Yes.
Q: It's mind-boggling to think of Newton writing those phrases. A: Well, this was the enigmatic language of alchemy. I mean "enigmatic" in a quite strict sense: it was a riddling language. The best way to look at these metaphors is in the light of riddles. So the "menstrual blood of the sordid whore" is decipherable. It means simply the metalline form of antimony. That is the "menstrual blood" that's extracted from the "sordid whore," which is the ore of antimony.
Q: It's a coded language. A: It is a code, and it's clear that the alchemists delighted in this code. It's almost a form of poetry. In fact, lots of alchemists wrote in the form of poetry, quite literally. edited by Zeedee on 6/28/2013
-- Please do not send me monstrous invitations tinged with the inks of the undernight or Boxed Cats. (I rotate my Starveling list, so it might take me a while to reach your name. I haven't forgotten anyone!)
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 Diptych Administrator Posts: 3493
7/5/2013
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Spacemarine9 wrote:
Maybe it's time to break out the rats again.
Dear heavens, man, the postal system can't bear it. Couriers are pursued by hungry urchins! Boxed cats are arriving in a frankly unmentionable state! My new hat was delivered bearing a family of seven tiny but respectable rats, featuring a well-appointed parlour, an upstairs shower-bath, and a squirrel lodger who worked as a bank clerk and collected porcelain horses! edited by Sir Frederick Tanah-Chook on 7/5/2013
-- Sir Frederick, the Libertarian Esotericist. Lord Hubris, the Bloody Baron. Juniper Brown, the Ill-Fated Orphan. Esther Ellis-Hall, the Fashionable Fabian.
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 Diptych Administrator Posts: 3493
6/18/2013
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Hmmmmm. Speculation hat on! (Speculative Hat, +6 Watchful, +1 Bizarre.)
The Nadir? Of the Fall? If so, which fall? The Fall from Grace? The Fall of Lucifer? The Fall of London, or another City?
The Secret of Secrets? Does this refer to the Secretum Secretorum, said to be the correspondence sent by Aristotle to Alexander the Great? I note that this text includes mention of a cave in which was found the final resting place and mortal remains of Hermes Trismegistus (for whom the sealing of jars is named.) There, clasped in his dead fingers, was a tablet of emerald bearing exhortations of the Principle of Correspondence, followed by discussion of the relations between the Earth, the Sun and the Moon, and how the power of this understanding will bring to the bearer all the brightness of the world.
-- Sir Frederick, the Libertarian Esotericist. Lord Hubris, the Bloody Baron. Juniper Brown, the Ill-Fated Orphan. Esther Ellis-Hall, the Fashionable Fabian.
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 theodor_gylden Posts: 117
6/24/2013
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For those curious about the mythology behind Fallen London, and to what the Shrine of Deep Blue Heaven might refer -- I reviewed my resources on Mongolian sky gods, and came across this entry in a certain well-known encyclopedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tengriism
I was surprised also to read the following:
An idiom in Turkish which is used when one feels too ashamed of something — "Yerin yedi kat altına girdim which means "I have gone into the seventh floor of the ground" — is linked to Tengrism. Barış Manço made a song called "Lady of the seventh sky" in 1975. (In Tengrism, it is believed that the earth and the sky have seven floors/sections.) Seven is, as they say, the number. edited by theodor_gylden on 6/24/2013
-- Journal: http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/echo_theodor Annotations & Epistles: http://theodor-gylden.dreamwidth.org/ Storylet: http://theodor-gylden.dreamwidth.org/11160.html
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 Spacemarine9 Posts: 2234
6/18/2013
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I think the nicest thing about this whole deal is that you get to keep leftover supplies for future expeditions, so you aren't penalised for over-packing. Although I have to question who would be psyched up enough about ARCHAEOLOGY!!! to pack 100 supplies either way. You'd probably need some kind of convoy of wagons to carry that much stuff. Or an army of very loyal porters. comedy option: a horde of rats carrying your luggage across the Quarter edited by Spacemarine9 on 6/18/2013
-- my rats will blot out the sun Ratgames FL lore/mechanics questions and answers #FallenLondon IRC (irc.synirc.net) Channel! Click to join via Mibbit. #SunlessSea IRC channel! Like the above, but zee-ier.
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 falsity Posts: 10
6/24/2013
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Ok you guys I'm not trying to be too fussy here, but this is surely a bit much:
 edited by falsity on 6/24/2013
-- Wally Bloodnose false negative
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 Spacemarine9 Posts: 2234
6/24/2013
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It's hard enough to get the cards you want at the best of times, adding undiscardable cards with high penalties and frequencies makes it even worse! I mean I guess you can get rid of the cards by ditching their corresponding item, but it's still kinda weird. I mean, the Scuttering Company are better in almost every way to the Matriarch anyway. The skull, on the other hand, is an item needed to unlock future content, plus there's an actual reason to hoard them (the Cinder conversion) I wonder if it's pointin at a shift in design principles in the future or if Alexis has finally absorbed enough misery to take on his true hell-lich form edited by Spacemarine9 on 6/24/2013
-- my rats will blot out the sun Ratgames FL lore/mechanics questions and answers #FallenLondon IRC (irc.synirc.net) Channel! Click to join via Mibbit. #SunlessSea IRC channel! Like the above, but zee-ier.
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 Finvara Posts: 430
7/14/2013
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IT SEES ALL!!!
But then it immediately forgets all, so that's not really so bad.
-- http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Professor~Varald
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 NiteBrite Posts: 1019
6/21/2013
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Ow ow ow. Can't discard -and- minus 50 CP of shadowy? DANG. These eyeless skulls are so brutally metal. If only it was watchful damage instead of shadowy... maybe then I could finally go back and finder that heiress :V
Edit: Dude. Its a frequent card that you can draw multiple times too. edited by NiteBrite on 6/22/2013
-- I AM currently accepting calling cards. Stats loss counter: reset, irrigo equivalent: none [00:34] <@ortab> NiteBrite's laugh is that of a condemned soul gazing into the abyss. Merciless Modiste avatar by Paul Arendt (based on an original image by Joe England) http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/TheBriteModiste
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 Alexis Kennedy Posts: 1374
7/6/2013
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Those of you pointing out the irrigo penalties aren't that high: design notes time! As with so many of these design issues, I may or may not have made the 'right' decision, but there's quite a lot going on under the surface.
Herein SPOILERS!
[spoiler]
First of all, they're a little more severe than you think, because the storylet which ejects you does some extra damage. But there are other considerations.
- The Forgotten Quarter in its new form is designed to cater for players across a very wide range of stats. You could get into the Nadir with Watchful as low as 60 - it would take a lot of persistence and luck, but it's possible. Down in the 40-70 range, stat damage means a lot more.
- Anywhere that we don't pad the sharp edges of the game, some players bash their heads on those sharp edges until they're bloody, and guess who they blame? Even when we've put up a warning notice? I still get emails complaining about the penalties on the Mr Eaten storyline, although I could hardly have made the warnings clearer unless I went round and tattooed them on every participating player. I know I will already get emails from players demanding I reset their stats because they didn't realise what would happen in the Nadir. (For the record my response to that is to send a regretful form reply if they're polite, and ignore if they're aggressive, but I don't like making any player unhappy.)
To put it another, kinder way, FL is unusual in being so resolutely persistent, and we need to be careful about applying big long-term changes based on spur-of-the-moment decisions, because inevitably people click at haste and repent at leisure. It doesn't mean we never do it: it's just the kind of thing that gets discussed and playtested. There are nasty surprises out there, but the Nadir is unusual in that it allows you to pay out quite a lot of rope before you find out how severely you might get hung.
- The Nadir works best unspoiled. If I made the penalties more severe, there would be more people over the next two years saying 'for God's sake don't spend more than x actions in there, you'll suffer y effect' and fewer people saying 'ooh you've got a treat in store, but go carefully.'
- Compare the skulls, where every click is optional, and where you never build up cumulative effects. You find out what the penalty is the first time you draw it, and if you don't like the effect, sell the skull when the next card comes up! It's worth a bit, after all. I appreciate that people have been trained to play pack-rat: the skulls are an early prod in a new direction.
- And the biggest consideration. Broadly speaking, quality effects play two purposes, though those purposes often overlap: (i) they unlock or lock choices (whether that means changing a relationship to an NPC or getting 0.02% closer to an Overgoat); (ii) they provide a sense of substance to the fiction. The Nadir stat change is more (ii) than (i). it provides a rationale for the limit on return, and an indication of what might happen if you hung around. Pearl diving is a good analogy: the intention is to force you return to the surface, not choose between riches and potential dismemberment at every point. (I wanted to add options to make the card drawing more strategic, and I wanted to allow long-shot risks on later, more informed, visits to the Cave, but the FQ is already an enormous content release and we were just out of time. Maybe someday)
- And finally, as ever, I'll be monitoring, and the mechanics may change.
[/spoiler]
Thanks for your very enthusiastic response, folks. It's always nice to see people being properly eeried.
edited by Alexis on 7/6/2013
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 Alexis Kennedy Posts: 1374
7/6/2013
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You all should have been thrown out of the cave at 10 irrigo: this was a bug I've now corrected. So you lucky few who got in early, consider this an extended preview tour, since all your irrigo dissipates at once.. The stat damage must hurt, though.
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 MisterArendt Administrator Posts: 37
7/12/2013
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February might agree there is a resemblance, but of course you can't necessarily trust her. As for sidelong glances, yeah, I just like drawing those.
-- http://misterarendt.deviantart.com/
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 Alexis Kennedy Posts: 1374
7/16/2013
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>dictionary
Mr Pages' Definiculate Dictionary. Where you'll also find that peligin is the colour of the Unterzee; except where the moonish light tints the wave-caps apocyan.
>infrarence
It's too dangerous to say.
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 Flyte Administrator Posts: 671
6/24/2013
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My take on this: so far in Fallen London we've had two kinds of choice -- narrative choice (side with a Devil or a spirifer; expose the true culprit, or the one with conveniently unimportant friends) and merely tactical choice (grind in Spite or Hunter's Keep; buy an Exceptional Hat, or save up for a Monocle). Up to now the tactical choices have mostly been rather trivial. A dedicated player could grind enough to buy all the gear and reach a point where all challenges were straightforward. That doesn't make for interesting gameplay.
I imagine future content will introduce many more situations where gear and character builds have downsides as well as benefits, so that the optimal strategy will no longer be to just hoard lots of everything. I think this is a good thing. But then, if I had my way Correspondence scholars would be shunned by polite society, and Neathy poets would long for a steady commission, and if it were about mushrooms they'd take it and be thankful it wasn't another jingle about the virtues of Mrs Plenty's rubbery lumps.
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 Sara Hysaro Moderator Posts: 4514
6/24/2013
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Seems like you ought to head out to Zee or go on a heist. Or get rid of the skull until it lets you into the Cave of the Nadir.
Edit: It's 4 separate cards that each lower a different stat by 50 CP. edited by Sara Hysaro on 6/24/2013
-- http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Sara%20Hysaro Please do not send SMEN, cat boxes, or Affluent Reporter requests. All other social actions are welcome.
Are you a Scarlet Saint? Send a message my way to be added to the list.
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 Spacemarine9 Posts: 2234
6/19/2013
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Spacemarine9 wrote:
Although I have to question who would be psyched up enough about ARCHAEOLOGY!!! to pack 100 supplies
The answer is "me, apparently"
-- my rats will blot out the sun Ratgames FL lore/mechanics questions and answers #FallenLondon IRC (irc.synirc.net) Channel! Click to join via Mibbit. #SunlessSea IRC channel! Like the above, but zee-ier.
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 Spacemarine9 Posts: 2234
7/4/2013
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i am never going to get into the cave of the nadir
-- my rats will blot out the sun Ratgames FL lore/mechanics questions and answers #FallenLondon IRC (irc.synirc.net) Channel! Click to join via Mibbit. #SunlessSea IRC channel! Like the above, but zee-ier.
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 Alexis Kennedy Posts: 1374
6/24/2013
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Flyte wrote:
Fallen London used to be about stuffing your pockets with strange jars and bits of string because some day they might be useful; now we're being encouraged to think differently. The game's not saying we're commiting an offence by looting ancient ruins for personal gain (Aten forbid!), just that some loot's inherently dangerous and, y'know, it might be best to sell it on and come back for more when we actually need it.
That's about it. :-)
Tesuji, I suggest you steer well clear of the FQ content. If you find the Skull mechanics incomprehensible and distressing, your confusion will only deepen.
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 Zeedee Posts: 276
6/29/2013
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Sir Frederick Tanah-Chook wrote:
The Correspondence corresponding to the Hermetic Principle of Correspondence has been my pet theory for yonks... I admit I've not really seen anything to confirm it, exactly, but I'll probably cling on to it until it's explicitly disproved (like my theory of the Second City was... twice!) What sort of convulsive conspiracy theorist are you if you don't wait to be disproved thrice before you give up?!
Sir Frederick Tanah-Chook wrote:
Personally, I think the devils devour the souls themselves, and don't seem to have any interest in aiding the Bazaar with its... projects... but otherwise, I like your theory a great deal. I don't think the devils assist the Bazaar at all except when their interests collide. It's simply business...which leads me to wonder if any of the devils have signed contracts with the Bazaar. That would crack me up. Oh, and I believe at least some devils consume souls.[spoiler]The thing is...why and how do they, um, digest it? If devils can partake of souls without destroying them, that would explain why there are still so many souls rolling around. It also explains the Infernal Sommelier's familiarity with the flavor of such a staggering catalog. Souls are not items easily dismantled.
If solar power is such a potent spirit in itself, then wouldn't the devils want to be near it? To taste it? To gaze upon it? To conceal it? The ultimate treasure and source of sustenance in one! An infant star would be mighty hot and mighty bright... Enough to warm and light the spaces of Hell. Enough cause for Hell's reputation of a fiery abyss. A nadir, my dear.
While we're at it, would a star child born of the Sun and Moon not be plentiful nourishment for a fine Garden? One could grow strange fruits in such a place. Fruits tinged with some quality of immortality, enough to rejuvenate and cure the bodily aches of a man who's even dead? And that nearby Mountain of Light? It's a party hat crafted for the star by Mr Hats because that sulky Bazaar nursemaid wasn't giving the child any cheer. As thanks, the star rewarded Mr Hats with the gift of flaming immortality, and he was thus reborn as Mr Candles. Trufax! ...Whoops, my head seems to have diverged into fanciful fanfiction territory there.
Erik Vimes wrote:
Every team of writers needs someone like you, Zeedee, to distill the hidden truth from the muck of planted distraction. Funny how you say that as if I myself haven't planted any distraction. 
Erik Vimes wrote:
In relevance to eating souls,it makes me wonder if that's how Mr Eaten got his name. I'm fairly certain his background is true to the nickname, though the present drama surrounding him is possibly more important and amusing than the original events which led to the giving of said nickname.
Erik Vimes wrote:
It also makes me wonder about the new "Silent Soul" and what make it so unique. It might've not been eaten in the strictest sense, but drained of the most useful or delicious part, like squeezing the juice out of a lemon, leaving only the rind. Fantastic imagery!
The worship of ancestral spirits was and still is common among many Mongolian ethnicities and other Asians. I suspect the Silent Souls are souls of elevated priests, clan leaders and other notable figures who vowed to stay to guide and protect their descendants (or at least the esteemed ranks of the Elderly Tartar Priest's religion). The Silent Souls are unusually calm because they have no interest in rejoining their physical bodies; it should be the opposite. I doubt they were extracted with a Spirifer's Fork. And "Silent"? Unlikely. There's probably a way to communicate with them so they can dispense advice. If it's a case of classic Mongolian shamanism, you'll need a medium to channel them. I do not recommend the Shroud fellows for the task. :P[/spoiler] (Since we can only use 1 spoiler box per post, my reply to Erik Vimes is hidden up there.)
-- Please do not send me monstrous invitations tinged with the inks of the undernight or Boxed Cats. (I rotate my Starveling list, so it might take me a while to reach your name. I haven't forgotten anyone!)
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 Alexis Kennedy Posts: 1374
6/30/2013
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The branch requirement changes are the sound of bolts sliding back: but the door's still locked for now. Don't go crazy looking just yet. A couple of points from upthread:
- you won't need Fate to enter the Cave of the Nadir (though as ever, it will get you there quicker) - there is actually (as of today) a minimum result for the Temple reward. The range is still very wide, in order to allow us to give away the rather fabulous stuff at the luckier end without breaking our economy guidelines. - there are now five ways to get an Eyeless Skull, although two of those are very hard to find. edited by Alexis on 6/30/2013
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 Erik Vimes Posts: 182
6/30/2013
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I just realized how perfect it is that the most popular(and maybe efficient?) way to grind supplies is through whispered secrets. We stalk the cobblestones of the Neath, hoarding secrets in the quest to explore, discover, and uncover the unknown depths of the Fallen Fourth. And ultimately, in the end, we will discover (or at least try to) the ultimate truth, the Justices' pride, the secret of secrets. How did we accomplish this? By finding vast quantities of the relatively tiny and insignificant tidbits of hidden information and utilizing them to reveal enormously larger truths. There's almost something poetic about it.
-- http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Eric~Vimes
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 Flyte Administrator Posts: 671
6/30/2013
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Hmm. So it's known that Eyeless Skulls can be acquired with a rare success at the Shrine, or as a pair in an Unpredictable Treasure, which at present may only be available through expeditions to the Temple. That leaves one reasonably discoverable way, and two obscure ones. Some ideas:
- Rare successes on fourth-tier item conversions are generally worth around 62.50; perhaps one now gives an Eyeless Skull.
- Doing something inadvisable with a Nephrite Lens.
- Corpsecage Island.
- Excessive Correspondence scholarship. (Although you may be reluctant to give the resulting skull to Revolutionaries. Fortunately guillotines seem out of fashion.)
I've just estimated the chance of getting an Eyeless Skull on a rare success from a normal storylet/opportunity card, based on the assumptions that a) the storylet or card is no more profitable than the Affair of the Box, and b) a normal success gives 90-130 pence per action. The result: at most 1.2%. That would certainly explain why these methods would be hard to find. I'd guess the third non-obscure method is an item conversion. edited by Flyte on 6/30/2013
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 Dolan Posts: 296
7/1/2013
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http://fallenlondon.wikia.com/wiki/Wander_the_Quarter
That option gives a skull as a rare success.
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 Uniden Posts: 22
6/24/2013
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People like to collect stuff. Many people strive to collect everything possible. I think it's cool there are barriers and consequences to stuffing everything in your home.
I don't know what to say to your critique on the Midnight Matriarch and Scuttering Company, Tesuji. What were the items supposed to say on purchase?
"Hey, just so you know, cats and rats... don't exactly coexist peacefully."
You are essentially collecting people when you buy "pets." And some people... just don't get along. These "pets," though they have a slot in your inventory to jack into, are more than simply gadgets you adorn yourself with. To remain inert until you can do something useful for them. They have their own motivations and quirks. I like how Failbetter games are giving them personality. Even if it doesn't jive with the hopeful utopia of everyone living in your home in peace and harmony.
These are high level companions. It makes sense their effects will be strong. Whether positive or negative. edited by Uniden on 6/24/2013
-- Duel me: http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/profile/Victor~Gulenko
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 Theus Posts: 311
6/25/2013
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From what I can see, the design seems to be in service to a drum I've beaten before: meaningful choices. Pre-cat/rat, the "decision" to have pets/items/stuff was only informed by "Do I already have this stuff, and can I afford it?" This makes the decision a matter of when, not if, and is therefore not that mraningful.
Now, given the results of owning mm+ss or a skull, it's an actual meaningful choice. Do you own only one or the other, or do you deal with the consequences?
It's a bit uncomfortable for people used to playing FL like a point and click adventure game where you pick up the bowl of wax fruit, the can of pepsi, and the broken ketchup bottles because they are there and you may need them some day. Those people aren't wrong, and the most valid complaint I see is that introducing this mechanic on items costing hundreds of echoes feels punishing. No one expected a new mechanic to come with the new items, and it was not telegraphed (from what I understand, I haven't purchased either.)
-- http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Hefty~Harrison
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 Dolan Posts: 296
6/25/2013
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It's too late, it still looks like a butt to me. It's just been sitting in the same position for so long that the butt has flattened out.
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 Dolan Posts: 296
7/5/2013
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Also there is a LOT more to the Nadir thing than just the expedition, holy crap. I won't spoil anything but it's pretty damn awesome.
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 Zeedee Posts: 276
6/28/2013
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I can see why you would...
When Sir Frederick Tanah-Chook brought up Hermes Trismegistus and his work, I felt as if a titanic barrel of monkeys and their hammers had fallen upon my head -- so great was his revelation. Or, hey, it's just a bunch of fun and funny speculation.
-- Please do not send me monstrous invitations tinged with the inks of the undernight or Boxed Cats. (I rotate my Starveling list, so it might take me a while to reach your name. I haven't forgotten anyone!)
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 Flyte Administrator Posts: 671
6/29/2013
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Having now undertaken many, many expeditions, some further feedback. The random rewards are a good thing, and it's okay that some are of slight value, and that the average pence per action is rather low. But Failbetter, please, make failing... better.
The last two shrines I explored yielded treasures worth 14.5 and 16 echoes. These time-consuming expeditions achieved the teeth-gnashing return of around minus 62 pence per action. For 50 or so actions. My suggestion: make it so that expeditions can't uncover treasures likely to be worth significantly less than the resources expended to supply them.
Three argument-observations for this point: a) I have all the gear I want and am now not much concerned about profit, yet this still stung; b) some expeditions cost Fate, and some of those who undertake them will be afflicted with a sense of entitlement; and c) someone, somewhere, will receive five such rewards in a row, and your lawyers will struggle to fend off their tortious claim for replacement molars.
Also, about the skulls. I still approve of their menacing nature, but it seems my aspiration to accumulate five was misguided. I have only the one I found in my first shrine. Which is fine. But I hope I didn't mislead anyone with my misplaced optimism. edited by Flyte on 6/29/2013
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 Alexis Kennedy Posts: 1374
7/5/2013
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Don't say we never do anything nice for you.
http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/a/othoufavoured
It has only 77 uses and we'll be releasing it more publicly, so take advantage soon.
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 Diptych Administrator Posts: 3493
7/5/2013
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Not often you get to see a screen like this, these days!
-- Sir Frederick, the Libertarian Esotericist. Lord Hubris, the Bloody Baron. Juniper Brown, the Ill-Fated Orphan. Esther Ellis-Hall, the Fashionable Fabian.
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 Spacemarine9 Posts: 2234
7/5/2013
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I, uh. Well. The Cave is quite something.
-- my rats will blot out the sun Ratgames FL lore/mechanics questions and answers #FallenLondon IRC (irc.synirc.net) Channel! Click to join via Mibbit. #SunlessSea IRC channel! Like the above, but zee-ier.
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 Spacemarine9 Posts: 2234
7/5/2013
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I'm worried about the level of SMEN-design that was being channeled during the creation of this hellish place. Yeah ok so it's going to hurt, but how much? do i want to know??? maybe i should just stay here forever
-- my rats will blot out the sun Ratgames FL lore/mechanics questions and answers #FallenLondon IRC (irc.synirc.net) Channel! Click to join via Mibbit. #SunlessSea IRC channel! Like the above, but zee-ier.
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 Dolan Posts: 296
7/6/2013
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Just go to A State of Some Confusion repeatedly and lower your What The Thunder Said quality that way. It's as easy as jumping through a mirror. edited by Dolan on 7/6/2013
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 Flyte Administrator Posts: 671
6/19/2013
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I've done this three times now. Twice I got 400 Glim, 200 Whispered Secrets and a Storm Threnody. Just now I got 500 Souls, a Collection of Curiosities and four Aeolian Screams. Also, the text which came with the Souls was... interesting.
I think Failbetter have struck a perfect balance here between two things which are generally in tension:
a) Making a piece of content accessible to characters of widely ranging ability levels; and b) Making it appealing to characters at the upper end of that range.
Anyone with moderately decent Watchful can organise an expedition, but the very Watchful can pull it off in fewer actions, so rewards scale appropriately. edited by Flyte on 6/19/2013
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 Spacemarine9 Posts: 2234
6/20/2013
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As ever with new content, I've written up an overly-detailed and verbose guide to this expedition business! I'll probably keep it updated with tweaks and changes for a week or so.
As a sidenote, it seems like Seeking Curios and Secrets in the Forgotten Quarter has changed a bit; there are a few options locked/unlocked at certain Airs qualities, with varying rewards (the same storylet gave me 126 Whispered Secrets and 103 Whispered Secrets on two different occasions) edited by Spacemarine9 on 6/20/2013
-- my rats will blot out the sun Ratgames FL lore/mechanics questions and answers #FallenLondon IRC (irc.synirc.net) Channel! Click to join via Mibbit. #SunlessSea IRC channel! Like the above, but zee-ier.
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 theodor_gylden Posts: 117
6/24/2013
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Erik Vimes wrote:
theodor_gylden wrote:
For those curious about the mythology behind Fallen London, and to what the Shrine of Deep Blue Heaven might refer -- I reviewed my resources on Mongolian sky gods, and came across this entry in a certain well-known encyclopedia:... Seven is, as they say, the number
I have a feeling that the sky god is the same one we dream of and the one who we embody when we visit the Mind of a Long Dead God. I have a feeling the shrine doesn't have anything to do with Seeking but might have instead been a place of worship to aforementioned god while it was still alive (or being kept alive by prayer if you want to take a Discworld-esque look at it).
Now there's an idea I've not explored. The Dreams of Chess suggest that the Beleaguered King learned the Correspondence from the Thunder.
-- Journal: http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/echo_theodor Annotations & Epistles: http://theodor-gylden.dreamwidth.org/ Storylet: http://theodor-gylden.dreamwidth.org/11160.html
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 Anstruther Barron Posts: 92
6/18/2013
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I got a storm-threnody and 200 whispered secrets from my treasure
-- http://www.fallenlondon.com/Profile/Anstruther~Barron
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 Spacemarine9 Posts: 2234
6/24/2013
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The penalties for having a Skull are pretty damn harsh, especially as the skulls themselves really rare, you need one of them for the Cave of the Nadir and you can collect 5 of them to trade them in for a ray-drenched cinder. The cards seem to be fairly common too! And there's four of 'em.
50CP is an entire level of stat! Not even the menace cards for Seeking are that harsh! edited by Spacemarine9 on 6/24/2013
-- my rats will blot out the sun Ratgames FL lore/mechanics questions and answers #FallenLondon IRC (irc.synirc.net) Channel! Click to join via Mibbit. #SunlessSea IRC channel! Like the above, but zee-ier.
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 Owen Wulf Posts: 715
6/24/2013
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Haha, thats funny - is it a glitch?
--
Owen Wulf's Profile Lanzo Hoffman’s Profile Lukas Uller’s Profile
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 Erik Vimes Posts: 182
6/24/2013
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Tesuji wrote:
Spacemarine9 wrote:
I wonder if it's pointin at a shift in design principles in the future or if Alexis has finally absorbed enough misery to take on his true hell-lich form Having four high-frequency undiscardable cards that eat a level's worth of a stat go beyond just "You're playing the game wrong" to "Either start playing the game right or GTFO, and I'm fine either way." I think you're taking this a little too personally. That's not the message this content is sending out unless you take it to be. I'm guessing you're not a seeker, Tesuji, because it's a comparable quest: possessing the skull, like seeking, is detrimental to your character, but that doesn't mean you're not able to do it. In its simplest form, the cards are a ward from playing the content in exactly the same way all the insanity and betrayal are to Seekers. It's your decision whether to suffer the consequences and play it, and just because the game doesn't blatantly tell you to turn back every action like it does for Seekers doesn't mean it's any different.
Flyte's insight is what you should be listening to, not getting angry that you can't have everything without ill effects. I too share your desire to have/experience everything at least once, but the simplicity of that might change with some new content and isn't necessarily a bad thing.
If the cards bother you, either go on a heist or something to be rid of them or just sell/trade in the skull to be rid of your problem and get a new one when the skull-locked content comes out. edited by Eric Vimes on 6/24/2013
-- http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Eric~Vimes
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 Dolan Posts: 296
6/24/2013
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I don't mind the Skull cards so much, but I really do think they should be one card with four options, rather than four cards with one option. The Mr. Eaten menace cards aren't nearly as punishing, and the danger of that whole storyline is hyped to hell and back. Having this silly skull be far more dangerous than Seeking Mr. Eaten's Name kind of undermines the whole idea.
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 OPG Posts: 387
9/4/2013
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Oh. I bought two before I went into the Cave. I love foresight.
-- overpoweredginger, an irresistible, magnificent, midnight and sagacious gentleman.
A Fallen London Roleplay Community exists. Contrary to popular belief, Richard Nixon is not involved.
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 Guest
11/7/2013
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For those who are curious, I echoed in my journal the Gallery of Serpents expedition (the resolution, at least).
In case you're wondering, no special or unique objects are given with this storylet.
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 Rook Crofton Posts: 83
11/22/2013
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Zeedee wrote:
Has anyone raised their "Counting the Days" to 15 or higher with this option? http://fallenlondon.wikia.com/wiki/Fortune%27s_page
If so, did you discover any new options on the "Secrets and Spending" card or anywhere else?
14 is usually the highest limit of CtD, but the Nadir option pushes it beyond 14... How high do you have to go to find a fortune of particular interest? Maybe even something the Numismatrix has mentioned?
I've raised Counting the Days to 18 so far (see my profile), using this option from the Nadir, visiting the Repentant Forger, and looking at the mind-rending graffiti. For some reason, all three of these options work at CtD 14+. So far, there's been no effect; no new options on the Secrets and Spending card.
Folks, does this seem like a bug, or something with a hidden potential (like grinding Stormy-Eyed up to 15)?
-- Rook Crofton: dreamer, antiquarian, mystic Now a Scarlet Saint. Happy to send anyone an invite to the Temple Club.
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 Corran Posts: 401
11/23/2013
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Rook Crofton wrote:
Folks, does this seem like a bug, or something with a hidden potential (like grinding Stormy-Eyed up to 15)?
I doubt it will do anything but I applaud your inquisitiveness.
-- My Fallen London profile
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 Zeedee Posts: 276
7/12/2013
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MisterArendt wrote:
February might agree there is a resemblance, but of course you can't necessarily trust her. Might as well mention now that I also entertained thoughts of her being a shapeshifting fox woman, a beautiful trickster lady. There are many folktales of love centered around the kitsune with this being one of the most famous: http://academia.issendai.com/foxtales/japan-come-and-sleep.shtml That train of thought led me to think Mr Iron must be her natural animal predator (an eagle, wolf, coyote, bear...um, badger): http://www.thefoxwebsite.org/faq/foxecology.html Those were my original idle thoughts when I saw February's icon and read some narrative tidbits about her. The Interpreter resemblance struck me far later.
MisterArendt wrote:
As for sidelong glances, yeah, I just like drawing those. And I like looking at them. (It would be awful if I didn't...since half of the characters have side glances...) But the brows! The raised, intellectual brows of the Interpreter and February eat away at a tiny part of my mind. Not a bad thing, though, and you didn't clear anything up. In fact, you only planted different conspiracy theory seeds in my head, but that's pretty par for the course when I try to puzzle out Fallen London.
By the way, your Vake ambition? Loving it! I'm eagerly looking forward to more. It's one of the topmost stories I adore.
-- Please do not send me monstrous invitations tinged with the inks of the undernight or Boxed Cats. (I rotate my Starveling list, so it might take me a while to reach your name. I haven't forgotten anyone!)
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 Spacemarine9 Posts: 2234
7/14/2013
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I'm not sure if an Irrigoat would be more or less terrifying than the standard Overgoat.
-- my rats will blot out the sun Ratgames FL lore/mechanics questions and answers #FallenLondon IRC (irc.synirc.net) Channel! Click to join via Mibbit. #SunlessSea IRC channel! Like the above, but zee-ier.
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 Flyte Administrator Posts: 671
7/6/2013
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My stat losses weren't that bad. Assuming the penalty increases in direct proportion to your Irrigo, [spoiler]you'll lose around five change points of each primary quality for every point of Irrigo.[/spoiler]
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 Flyte Administrator Posts: 671
7/6/2013
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Sir Frederick Tanah-Chook wrote:
Oh, and half the stuff I tried to echo to my journal didn't keep, because we can apparently no longer change the titles of journal entries, and titles in quotation marks auto-format to blank for some reason, and echoes with blank titles don't save for some reason. Which is a bit weird. Yeah, this is very vexing. About the Stormy-Eyed: have you tried giving Dr Schlomo lots of Beetles? His What the Thunder Said card is very rare, but it should do the job eventually.
Alexis, I had 41 Irrigo. The stat damage didn't hurt. Because we don't know how much we'll be penalised while we're in the cave, there's a delightful sense of dread, like some fairy tale where we know a child's doing something very foolish, only now we're implicated because it turns out that we really can't resist all that gingerbread...
But precisely because of that period of uncertain, wild-eyed dread, the actual losses feel quite mild, and oddly unthreatening. Did you want me to feel relief when I was hit by those penalties?
Would you consider a) raising the Irrigo cap and b) causing the damage to scale non-linearly with Irrigo? Perhaps, let's say, parabolically?
As it is, I suspect return players will almost always stay until they're expelled, which will tend to diminish the delightful conflict I've tried to describe. edited by Flyte on 7/6/2013
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 babelfishwars Administrator Posts: 1152
7/6/2013
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Alexis Kennedy wrote:
unless I went round and tattooed them on every participating player.
I'd get that tattoo. [spoiler]... if it was part of the seeking the name storyline. [/spoiler] edited by babelfishwars on 7/6/2013
-- Mars, God of Fish; Leaning Tower of Fish
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 Spacemarine9 Posts: 2234
7/6/2013
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[spoiler]25 mourning candles instead of a unique item was totally worth it just to yell at those two dorks though[/spoiler]
-- my rats will blot out the sun Ratgames FL lore/mechanics questions and answers #FallenLondon IRC (irc.synirc.net) Channel! Click to join via Mibbit. #SunlessSea IRC channel! Like the above, but zee-ier.
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 Sara Hysaro Moderator Posts: 4514
7/7/2013
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[spoiler]I don't think there's something wrong with you, though personally I get the same feel from the place as I would from a hospital room filled terribly ill people. [/spoiler]
-- http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Sara%20Hysaro Please do not send SMEN, cat boxes, or Affluent Reporter requests. All other social actions are welcome.
Are you a Scarlet Saint? Send a message my way to be added to the list.
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 Flyte Administrator Posts: 671
7/7/2013
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Below: a reply to some of Alexis's points, somewhat spoily, leavened with bad jokes and probably of little interest to anyone else (or indeed, perhaps, to him).
[spoiler]Alexis Kennedy wrote:
The Forgotten Quarter in its new form is designed to cater for players across a very wide range of stats. You could get into the Nadir with Watchful as low as 60 - it would take a lot of persistence and luck, but it's possible. Down in the 40-70 range, stat damage means a lot more. A couple of thoughts. First, the potential profits also mean a lot more to players with low stats. One trip can easily pay for some top tier footwear, when a normal storylet would only bring in ~60p per action. Second, few (if any) players will reach the Nadir with Watchful anywhere near that low. Here's a list of what they'd have to do:
- Find an Eyeless Skull. That's hard, but they could be lucky, right?
- Raise Intimate with a Secular Missionary to ten through opportunity cards. This took me a long time, playing the cards whenever they came up. My stats rose a lot from other things, in the meantime. Of course, they could do nothing but discard cards until the right ones came up. Not that that would be perverse, or anything.
- Find enough cash, Skulls, or connections to acquire the expensive thingamy needed to get in. I reckon that's 800-1400 stat change points. But maybe they have a lot of Fate?
- Fund and successfully undertake at least seven Expeditions to get Archaeologist to five. That's a lot of grinding for supplies, and a load of Watchful challenges. Especially since, by hypothesis, their Watchful is really low.
- Complete a super hard Expedition with only 100 supplies. I did a back-of-the-envelope thing, and concluded that our precocious hero is basically doomed, unless they have a huge stockpile of Second Chances. Which you normally get by doing stuff that raises your Watchful. But you don't have to. And so help me, this player won't. They'll get them through opportunity cards. It'll pass the time while they get to know the Missionary.
If you find this person, I hope you'll make them test all your games. On the above evidence, I doubt they're that attached to their stats. I think far more players will be upset about the (frankly, much worse) consequences of failing the Expedition. Maybe you should enforce the Watchful 100 thing? There's plenty of other stuff to do in the Forgotten Quarter.
Alexis Kennedy wrote:
Anywhere that we don't pad the sharp edges of the game, some players bash their heads on those sharp edges until they're bloody, and guess who they blame? Even when we've put up a warning notice? I still get emails complaining about the penalties on the Mr Eaten storyline, although I could hardly have made the warnings clearer unless I went round and tattooed them on every participating player. I know I will already get emails from players demanding I reset their stats because they didn't realise what would happen in the Nadir. Sadly, even the existing penalties will alienate that constituency, since after all they're not complaining because they can't read, but because their conception of a game is infected by the 'ego-stroking' behavioural conditioning beloved of larger developers. If they pull the lever, they should get a treat, so dammit, Alexis, why did you come over and hit them with a stick? Even though you warned them? Do you like punishing your customers, you freak?
They won't forgive you, just because you use a smaller stick.
Alexis Kennedy wrote:
The Nadir works best unspoiled. If I made the penalties more severe, there would be more people over the next two years saying 'for God's sake don't spend more than x actions in there, you'll suffer y effect' and fewer people saying 'ooh you've got a treat in store, but go carefully.' Hmm. I agree Nadir spoilers are bad. But people are going to say the former thing already, because of the double penalty for hitting Irrigo 10. 'Always leave at Irrigo 9, unless you can get [the very expensive thing] with your next action.' The way to prevent that is not to use low penalties, but to make them incremental so there's no trivially optimal strategy.
Alexis Kennedy wrote:
And the biggest consideration. Broadly speaking, quality effects ... (ii) ... provide a sense of substance to the fiction. The Nadir stat change is more (ii) than (i). it provides a rationale for the limit on return, and an indication of what might happen if you hung around. Pearl diving is a good analogy: the intention is to force you return to the surface, not choose between riches and potential dismemberment at every point. (I wanted to add options to make the card drawing more strategic, and I wanted to allow long-shot risks on later, more informed, visits to the Cave, but the FQ is already an enormous content release and we were just out of time...) I also see this as a (ii). At the moment, the mechanics do everything you say. They justify the time limit, and communicate something about the nature of the place, and its hazards. I like this, but I think they can do more.
My unspoiled first visit was awesome. It also wasn't the experience you intended, because it was four times as long. I think I saw most of the content. On reflection, I can see the benefit of enforcing a shorter visit. I have a familiarity with the place that should have taken weeks; it's now correspondingly less marvellous, less strange. But all the while, I was in a state of massing dread at the price to be exacted. That's a rare example in Fallen London of an actually interesting gameplay choice, but I think it also has a narrative value consonant with the nature of the story and the place; the Firebrand and the Missionary and February and you are all seeking so hard for this terribly dangerous place, because there's something there, though you're not quite sure what, that maybe you want and maybe can use...
Next week, and the week after, I'll go back and lose a level of each primary stat. Or two, for something very melancholy. That thing I just tried to describe has gotten lost, along with the difficult gameplay choice.
Here's my suggestion:
- Remove the extra penalty from the Irrigo 10 auto-fire storylet, so we don't go around telling everyone to leave at Irrigo 9.
- Add an option to that storylet which allows the player to stay in the Cave. Have it unlock with whatever you consider sufficiently high Watchful. Kick the player out when they hit Irrigo 20. Warn of escalating consequences.
- When the player leaves, reduce their stats by, say, Irrigo squared. That conveniently gives the present penalty for Irrigo 10. It avoids sharp cut-offs which make gameplay choices easy. It allows players to hurt themselves pretty badly (up to eight stat points), but only if their stats are high enough and they disregard clear warnings. It's not high enough for players to exhaust the mysteries of the Cave, and it fits the atmosphere of the place. It creates interesting choices. It will probably also do your laundry and reply to bug reports.
[/spoiler]Also, a request and a suggestion. Could you add an option to the Struggling Artist card to make him forget you, unlocked with 10 Irrigo? Only, you know, the whole thing was embarrassing and long ago and I changed addresses eight times without telling him... he still touches me for money.
The suggestion: add a Fate-locked option to change the choice you make when you leave. I'm sure some people would love to give you money for that. edited by Flyte on 7/8/2013
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 Aspeon Posts: 311
7/8/2013
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I'm starting to wonder if this is Fallen London's answer to raiding, and the third purpose of Irrigo is a raid lockout. Spoiler tagged some silly speculation, for the 1% chance that it's actually meaningful: (It's not even based on anything found in the Cave- I'm still waiting on the Firebrand to warm up to me)
[spoiler]"The Cave of the Nadir" anagrams to "Raid event: Hatch foe." That's the point of raids, after all- spawn the big boss to get the big loot. [/spoiler]
edited by Aspeon on 7/8/2013
-- A raccooning will not be postponed indefinitely.
http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Aspeon
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 Dmitri Zhiriakov Posts: 97
7/9/2013
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Flyte wrote:
3) When your rival's progress hits 10, there'll be an expensive way to reduce their progress.
This is actually untrue for this expedition- hindering the main rival costs all of 20 cryptic clues and gives you some progress, while hindering generic opponents will result in losing 10 supplies. edited by Dmitri Zhiriakov on 7/9/2013
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 Lawrence Growe Posts: 96
7/11/2013
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I have finally delved into the Nadir and would like to share my thoughts on it.
It is... horrifying. I relate to my character very strongly, and feeling him waste away, diminish, fade made me feel extremely uncomfortable. And the eyes, oh, THEIR EYES... *shudders* Horrifying.
In a good way, of course. I will certainly be back, and probably more than once, and without doubt pay dearly for my audacity - but for the first time in years I am not merely scratching the surface of Fallen London. For quite a while I have been living the life of an inescapable, sagacious, midnight and sinister gentleman who may run into an occasional snuffer or deal with an unruly clayman on his way from one soiree to another - in other words, an average man in the street. But now I feel I have dug deeper, dug to the very core of the Bazaar and saw beyond its gaudy facade.
I do not fully understand what I saw, but I saw horrors, and they have no eyes. But the answers lie there somewhere, and I must return.
Well done. Well done, I say, and may Providence be merciful to us all.
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 Diptych Administrator Posts: 3493
7/11/2013
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So, I see that we can now sell the location of the Nadir to one of London's factions - which, as well as some rare or unique rewards, offers the game's first opportunity to change favoured connections! I believe the only eligible factions are the Devils, the Urchins, the Game and the Revolutionaries. Is there, O FBG wizards, much likelihood of other factions getting wind of our discovery and joining the bidding? I'm modestly surprised we're not getting any offers from Society explorers, or Special Constables, or those damnable Criminal archaeologists like Dr Orthos. I admit that my own allies, the Bohemians, aren't the most likely candidates, but we can claim a few patrons - in the Palace or the Carnival - who have seen unusual things.
-- Sir Frederick, the Libertarian Esotericist. Lord Hubris, the Bloody Baron. Juniper Brown, the Ill-Fated Orphan. Esther Ellis-Hall, the Fashionable Fabian.
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 circe Posts: 435
7/11/2013
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After all the trouble to gain access I wonder if selling it would permanently lock the Cave?
Any one brave enough to sell the location ... I'm not.
-- Lady Circe in Fallen London - http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Lady~Circe Adding no Suppers without prior arrangement, with only 5 Free Evenings a week and being a Patron I can't accept them all. No Affluent Photographer, Sharing Research with Another Scholar or Boxed Cats accepted. I will send Boxed Cats though. All other social actions welcome. Will help menaces, please be reasonable.
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 Diptych Administrator Posts: 3493
7/11/2013
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I haven't sold it myself, but it appears that doing so does not lock the cave... but, you can only sell it to one faction.
-- Sir Frederick, the Libertarian Esotericist. Lord Hubris, the Bloody Baron. Juniper Brown, the Ill-Fated Orphan. Esther Ellis-Hall, the Fashionable Fabian.
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 Diptych Administrator Posts: 3493
7/11/2013
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They all describe their rewards on the relevant cards - the Revolutionaries and the Game appear to offer the most valuable items, and the Revolutionaries' is the only one that can't be found elsewhere (I think all of the others are offered by the Relickers.) edited by Sir Frederick Tanah-Chook on 7/11/2013
-- Sir Frederick, the Libertarian Esotericist. Lord Hubris, the Bloody Baron. Juniper Brown, the Ill-Fated Orphan. Esther Ellis-Hall, the Fashionable Fabian.
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 Diptych Administrator Posts: 3493
7/16/2013
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If irrigo is the colour of forgetfulness, is infrarence the colour of discovery?
-- Sir Frederick, the Libertarian Esotericist. Lord Hubris, the Bloody Baron. Juniper Brown, the Ill-Fated Orphan. Esther Ellis-Hall, the Fashionable Fabian.
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