Guest
11/2/2018
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I thought it might've just been my imagination, or bad luck, or poor decisions early on that led to me to still not have shadowy up to the unmodified max value on my main account (sitting at around 195 at the moment and slowly creeping up thanks to favors from criminals & urchins) but now that I've encountered the same problem with my alt I have to wonder.
Is there any particular reason why one of the four skills is so much more difficult to grind than the other 3?
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Monara
Posts: 162
11/2/2018
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It's not really more difficult than the other stats, but it's not really used much in end game grinds so it usually ends up behind.
In fact the shadowy social action (loitering) is one of the best for leveling if you use the shadowy lessons option.
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Gillsing
Posts: 1203
11/2/2018
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Fallen London gameplay seems best suited for Watchful and Persuasive, so those attributes seem to get more benefits, such as second chances, where five second chances can be turned into 1-50 CP. And if you always visit the Regretful Soldier in his lodgings you get 5 CP of Dangerous, which is something that Shadowy doesn't get. So that might be why it lags behind?
Back when I was grinding Shadowy the ~1.85 EPA Dramatic Tension for Collections of Curiosities grind was not yet blown out of the water by 2.2+ EPA grinds, so I was 'Doing Business at Wilmot's End' with 90% success chance for an average of 1.9 CP per Action. You could do that too. If you didn't have better things to do with your Actions. But I'm guessing that you do?
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Μαρσ
Posts: 49
11/2/2018
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If you grind shadowy without any care for profits, (the flit → the big score: choose a target → sell information → pass on information to a colleague) you can raise it to the cap quite fast.
(18 Cp casing + 1 Cp Shadowy = 5 actions
10 Cp Shadowy =10 Cp casing + 1 action
70 Cp / Lvl Shadowy
Means approximately 26 actions / lvl)
Edit: small correction in calculation
edited by Μαρσ on 11/2/2018
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Μαρσ,
A Londoner, Zubmariner, Chef, a Doctor, and an Invisible Eminence. All social actions are welcomed.
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Monara
Posts: 162
11/2/2018
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Getting invited to loiter with the other person picking shadowy lessons is 3 warning notes and 10cp watchful for one action. I don't think it gets any better than that.
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https://www.fallenlondon.com/profile/Miranah
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Kittenpox
Posts: 869
11/3/2018
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I had some spare action points and tried sending social actions, though I'm not sure I did it right as I couldn't see the Shadowy Lessons thing while doing so - it's been a while since I've looked into this stuff. :-)
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Kittenpox
Current [Fabulous Diamond] count: Twenty-Five (of 50). Halfway there! ^_^
Metaphysical Caprice: 11.
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Currently: Returned to the Neath, and regaining my footing in this place. :-)
NO PLANT BATTLES PLEASE.
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Vega
Posts: 150
11/5/2018
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I'm also playing an alt and have the same experience as OP. What follows are purely anecdotal observations based on my own gameplay.
I think the big culprit is Preparing for a Big Score in the Flit. You start that while playing through A Name Whispered in Darkness 5-6, when Shadowy is generally around 50-100. However, this carousel spends 3-5 actions a pop. While the returns on Casing... progress are commensurate with actions spent, the returns on raising Shadowy are not, ie. you're always spending 3-5 actions gaining X cp of Shadowy, vs. 1 action gaining X cp for other stats on other carousels. So while your other stats are increasing in lock-step while playing the respective Making A Name storylines, Shadowy gain is falling behind on A Name Whispered in Darkness 5-6.
So Shadowy is prone to languish until you get to Bats & Cats, Mahogany Hall's variety show, and A Boxful of Intrigue. But Embroiled in the Wars of Illusion and A Survivor of the Affair of the Box aren't very long stories, compared to comprehensive story-based carousels such as Making Progress/Breeding in the Labyrinth of Tigers (Dangerous only) and Featuring in the Tales of the University/Flute Street (Watchful only). Story-wise, there isn't much incentive to grind out Shadowy for a while.
Furthermore, A Boxful of Intrigue is the only Shadowy endgame carousel; Bats & Cats and Casing in the Flit (and Pickpocketing in Spite) yield low/mid-level rewards. And Wilmot's End, War of Assassins and the Variety Show allow you to use other stats to advance the carousels. Sitting on a carousel usually means grinding for the rewards at the end, and playing action-efficiently means I want to get them as quickly as possible without wasting actions on failures. So I'm already preferring my higher stats when sitting on those carousels. So Shadowy languishes even more.
There simply aren't many lengthy stories or carousels featuring the Shadowy stat alone. And it's exacerbated in the early game by Preparing for a Big Score's action expense. (IIRC, my alt's Shadowy always was about 10-15 levels behind the other stats in the mid-game/early POSI.) If each choice didn't use up 3-5 actions, it would be a fine mid-game carousel to complement Boxful of Intrigue. But as it is, it's just not worth the return-on-actions.
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edited by Vega on 11/9/2018
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The Jaunty Mystic, Taranlei, roams the streets of London, interviewing fellow citizens. Member of the Sanguine Ribbon Society and the Temple Club (happy to send invites). Accepting all Acquaintances, lethal duels, social interactions, and opportunities for casual roleplay.
The Shifty Spectre has departed on the final voyage. "I have gone down, down, my love..."
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Guest
11/5/2018
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Welp I'd call that a sufficiently thorough explanation. And yeah, it's not just a late game thing, I think you'll find that unless you're exclusively playing shadowy storylets or cheesing social actions shadowy's *always* your weakest stat.
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Zeculo The Squid
Posts: 12
12/18/2018
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Another difficulty is that suspicion is rather harder to deal with than the other main menaces. You can get rid of nightmares, wounds, and scandal in your lodgings without roping in another player, spending echoes, or needing an opportunity card; while you more or less have to use absolution ablution or social actions to get rid of suspicion. Unlike scandal and nightmares, suspicion has lasting consequences that can’t be undone, and unlike wounds there’s no emergency backup item.
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Azothi
Posts: 586
12/18/2018
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Zeculo The Squid wrote:
Another difficulty is that suspicion is rather harder to deal with than the other main menaces. You can get rid of nightmares, wounds, and scandal in your lodgings without roping in another player, spending echoes, or needing an opportunity card; while you more or less have to use absolution ablution or social actions to get rid of suspicion. Unlike scandal and nightmares, suspicion has lasting consequences that can’t be undone, and unlike wounds there’s no emergency backup item. Opportunism in Spite has "Confound the Constables" at Airs 1-25, which gives Suspicion reduction. It's less effective than social actions, but it's useful, especially early on. Furthermore, there's the Workman's Clothes/Sober Dress, giving Suspicion -1, which gives you more breathing room before arrest (8 CP is quite a bit in the grand scheme of things). Additionally, if you're willing to sacrifice the Steadfast nature of a character, the Menace card for Suspicious always has an option to reduce Suspicion.
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Azoth I, the Emissary of Cardinals - A Paramount Presence (not currently accepting new Proteges)
Away to where the Chain cannot bind us.
 Hesperidean.
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Plynkes
Posts: 631
12/18/2018
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I use that option quite a lot. Not just for the Suspicion reduction, but also for all the free weasels!
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"Then tell Wind and Fire where to stop, but don't tell me."
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lukeskylicker
Posts: 85
12/19/2018
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If you have the cash to burn (and haven't been arrested numerous times) suspicion is in my opinion the easiest to burn off.
It's a bit more expensive than ladium and tinctures but the instant ablution also can do more menace reduction and is the only purchasable scandal reduction (even if it's only one point at a time).
This is all assuming you haven't been incarcerated a bunch of times already.
Still, even then you have the clothes suspicion reducing clothes and an almost annoyingly frequent card that pops up when you have high suspicion and let's you lower it.
With that said though I'm an invisible eminence and outside the faction cards and renown items I rarely have issues with failing shadowy checks.
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http://fallenlondon.com/Profile/lukeskylicker
A man who likes to sound smart when he's really just making it up as he goes.
Rehabilitator of Wretched Mogs.
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Meradine Heidenreich
Posts: 468
12/19/2018
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Does nobody else get rid of suspicion without increasing their criminal record via robbing the Brass Embassy? No worse than a brief stay in the Tomb Colonies...
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https://www.fallenlondon.com/profile/Meradine%20Heidenreich
The Starveling kit
Gobbled up the bit
of cheese on my tray ..
"O Weh!"
No plant battles, please.
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Jolanda Swan
Posts: 1783
12/19/2018
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A devilish loophole!
Joking aside, since I visit the Nadir quite often I always try to build my stats up. Shadowy is easily accomplished through a few heists. For Dangerous, i have to go through the Forgotten Quarter carousel, and is the hardest to grind. but 195 to 200 should be doable with around ten heists, I think!
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Lover of all things beautiful, secret admirer of ugly truths, fond of the Parabola Sun... and always delighted to role play.
http://fallenlondon.com/profile/Jolanda%20Swan
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D
Posts: 31
12/21/2018
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People have already gone over most of the reasons this is so; one that I didn't see mentioned is that the other three stats each have three Factions whose card will let you trade favors for a stat boost, Shadowy only has two (since Rubbery Men lack the option) and Criminal and Urchin favors are frequently used for other options.
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The Androgyne Libertine - Explore Every Present
- Shattering Force, Crooked Cross. Accepts patronage requests and salon invitations.
The Liminal Witch - Fight for the Future
- Shattering Force. Accepts patronage requests.
The Inexorable Scrivener - Read What Was, Write What Is, Search For What Is Yet To Be
- Correspondent, Extraordinary Mind. Accepts patronage requests and orphanage invitations.
The Boneless Detective - Sought the Name.
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