ExcArc
Posts: 44
6/24/2016
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Be warned that this contains spoilers.
I recently opted to raise the "Supremacy: the Dawn Machine" quality up to 7 in order to see what would happen. Having completed the task with great difficulty I returned home to London to find...
Very little change, if any at all. The text was mildly eerie, but versus the Neath's background creepiness it wasn't enough to do much as register a blip. Yes, the Dawn Machine may brainwash people, but even so they don't seem to remove their personality. They have shown no great desire to harm humanity and certainly have been much kinder to humans than any other Judgement. Is a humanist Judgement, even one that asks for worship, truly that bad? Between monster and deity who care very little for us, I can think of many things worse.
Even my waif- er, favored colleague the Carnelian Exile who left the Dawn Machine has little enough bad to say, only stating that she left. Now I'm not ready to sign up as a Sequencer just yet, but can we truly and immediately call it evil?
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Julius Stokes
Posts: 113
6/25/2016
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THE SUN THE SUN THE SUN THE SUN THE SUN THE SUN -Sunless Sea
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http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Julias~Stokes - A revolutionary of his own sort, who has devoted his life to overthrowing the Bazaar, ascending to godhood, and saving London. Doesn't have to be in that order. I'll accept any social actions - except maybe suspicious loitering.
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Silphium
Posts: 5
7/8/2016
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It does raise some disturbing questions when TLON seems so naturally justified and the Dawn Machine seems so naturally evil (the ideas behind them are too close for comfort).
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For Jenny.
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A Dimness
Posts: 613
7/20/2016
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I never saw the Judgements as dictators. To me, the Judgements always were simply there to enforce laws of sensibility and logic, which is very much needed seeing as the Neath is a pretty horrifying place all around. The stars are just space-cops, yah?
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A truth so strange it can only be lied into existence
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Optimatum
Posts: 3666
7/25/2016
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Infinity Simulacrum wrote:
The stars are just space-cops, yah?
Nah, the stars are space politicians - they make the laws. It's the dragons that are the law enforcement.
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Optimatum, a ruthless and merciful gentleman. No plant battles, Affluent Photographer requests, or healing offers; all other social actions welcome.
 Want a sip of Cider? Just say hi!
PM me for information enigmatic or Fated. Though the forum please, not FL itself.
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ExcArc
Posts: 44
6/25/2016
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Fincar wrote:
First of all you should put a spoiler tag in the title of the topic if you are going to discuss something like this instead of the OP.
That said, the Dawn Machine it certainly is tyranic in it's own way, besides I think calling the Dawn Machine a "humanist Judgement" just because it dosen't inmediatly (physicaly) harm the humans arround it is going a bit too far. In that note he has done the exact same than any other Judgement and less than our own natural Sun (wich may I remind you is a Judgement).
Remember just being close enogh to the Machine is harmful to humans in the a psycological sense, and robs them of their free will, wich depending on your perspective may be worse than the other Judgements who usually limit themselves to the physical aplications of the Law. Emphasis on usually.
Apologies and noted for next time.
It's not just that they don't hurt them. The Dawn Machine actively works to make humans happier. They are not just not hurting humans, they are actively working with them much of the time, such as [spoiler]the decision to help you fight the sunlight or giving you a Dawn Element in exchange for your assistance.[/spoiler]
The free will avoidance is a bit harder to swallow, I'll admit, but there is very literal information on how that works. First, we know that people can leave it, potentially even willingly. Its treated like more of a cult than anything, and it could even be voluntary. If there's more information, maybe I missed it, but every interaction you have with the Dawn Machine happens with you approaching them. There are the bright barges, but every faction but London has violent boats so I'm more tempted to call that a gameplay convention.
I'm again not ready to sign up or call it unanimously good, but there's definitely more to the picture than just "Evil bastard mind controls for evil reasons."
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