BlabberingMat
Posts: 385
6/9/2016
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Now, I've been playing the FL for about three weeks now, and this is a question that had been bugging me ever since. I apologize if there is already topic on this, or if this is the wrong place for it...
My question is simple: I love this world, and I intend to keep playing as long as possible, but I have no means to pay for becoming an Exceptional Friend, or for Fate. Maybe I will one day, but for now, I am "doomed" to play the slow way, and wait for Actions. What I wonder is, is it worth it? How limited will my options be on the higher levels (after I become POSI, and up) if I don't pay? Is there any significant disadvantage compared to those who pay? Ecxcluding Fate-Locked content, of course. I'd like to hear from the high level people who are still playing for free ( if there are even someone like that XD)
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Alt-Lana Loter
Main-Always Drunk Slav
"To see a world in a grain of sand, and Heaven in wild flowers.
To hold an infinity in palm of hand and Eternity in an hour”
Finally, I am Crooked Cross! Feel free to send invitations for Salon!
As of June 5th, 1895, I am London's newest Legendary Charisma!
The current progress in Mega Soul Grind: 53727/1 639 121 Souls
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Parelle
Posts: 1084
6/9/2016
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Grenen and I started almost at the same time (October 2014) and I only purchased Fate this week. Judging from the forums, I think we are some of the furtherest along players who aren't Extraordinary Friends.
I paid because I enjoy this game and wanted to support Failbetter (although I have no plans on getting EF, just using Fate for stories). I had played long enough that I knew what storylines I wanted to continue (I think suicide and I are speaking of the same two cards on this instance! Perhaps if they were just storylets in my lodgings I wouldn't have felt as much urge to pay for them).
Here's what I managed in a year and a half of playing every day without Fate
- all Stats at 200
- free Content boundary
- end point of my ambition
- best in a slot BDR (23, if you're wondering. I have to agree that BDR is the one place where straight up paying Fate would make it easier as gaining both +2 in slot weapon and companion shapes your playstyle a bit needing a ship on the early end and the home comfort slot requires a certain profession.)
- a nomen this past winter (though I'm not crazy enough to try the tatoo, I could see Grenen trying it next year)
- an Overgoat
- enough cash on hand that I could buy my second Overgoat if I sold almost everything except for the other Overgoat (but I won't)
- highest level player wedding (which is worth about 3000-5000 echoes, depending how costs were split)
- currently Notablity 8, but I've hit 13 before.
- 2 of the 3 five card lodgings (I don't have the 3rd upgradable option)
- Hallowmas is the one place I felt a bit antsy about not having EF as it's time-delimited but even without it I managed the 2nd highest level.
I have to strongly disagree with the idea that the only finished content is paid. The EF Stories are meant to be one-off complete in of themselves, so yes, they're supposed to end. There are plenty of completed storylines with meaningful endings
[spoiler]University, Cheesemonger, Last Constable, Rats, Affair of the Box, and Jack of Smiles, just off the top of my head, and the ambitions require no Fate at all to pursue. [/spoiler]
The drift does seem to be from completed storylines to carousels, as content continues, which I'm kinda ehhhhh on but that's fine - I'd definitely like more to be completed, but I didn't feel that I was lacking content: you can chose to pursue options which are more varied (and this, after all isn't something that paying Fate for really helps, I don't believe). I won't speak for Grenen, but I know they pursue expeditions diligently and I usually do a somewhat ridiculous number of heists a week (I did 18 in about 10 days without doing them full time).
Put it this way: being a non-EF (as I still am) actually means a higher level of engagement with the game: since everyone gains cards and actions alike at the same rate, you have to check in more often so not to "waste" actions or cards.
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Parelle, Lady Joseph Marlen. The Singular Librarian. A Midnighter, a Player of the Marvelous.
pages from a dusty bookshop: a badly updated FL changelog | Useful Guidance and Explanations
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TheThirdPolice
Posts: 609
6/9/2016
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Unfortunately, I think squandering my estate on E. Friendship has rocketed me past these free-play chumps. I have:
* Achieved base persuasive 111 a mere 7 years after joining the game
* Transformed my opinion on the Exceptional Story Lost in Reflections into a buggy pet, named it, and stuck its ghost on my mantelpiece
* Represented seekers in the Devilish Salon of another Exceptional Story
* Sailed to Approaching Journey's End 31
* Collected one of each raven. Count 'em, that's SEVEN moderately easy to obtain pets.
* Turned into a creepy anarchist puppeteer who keeps convincing other players to advance Liberation while barely doing so myself
* Written a moderately recognized zee shanty
* Invented fake answers to an in-game crossword clue and a politically dangerous joke
* Failed to write a silly story using xkcd's simple words tool
* Discovered that Russians created their own Varchas with space mirrors (really)
* Leaked the secrets of the Fallen London writing team
* Attempted to convince people to accept the grim betrayal that would advance my Seeking, back in OG Eaten days, through a forum post claiming that I was selling the Skull of a Stone Pig, which approach an admin politely called 'creative' a moment before deleting it.
* Scarred, stained, and chained myself sevenfold
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Excessive Corpse & Tender to Irreal Ravens
Lover of Flawed Souls
And with especial pride, Worst Screwup of the Decade!
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BlabberingMat
Posts: 385
6/9/2016
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Kittenpox wrote:
I'm not sure how relevant this would be for you - and it's not specifically EF related, but is to do with buying Fate.
It was something I saw another forum user mention, and has been helpful for me, so I figure it may be worth sharing.
[spoiler]I don't buy Fate using credit card, etc. My mobile phone ('cell phone', for you Americans out there) is on a pre-paid thing, whereby I can pay my phone company about $30 to recharge and get a bunch of bonus credit and mobile data, which is usable within the next 30 days.
Given that I don't make *heaps* of calls, and I tend to use the data allowance over the course of a month, AND that my phone company charges $2/MB when I've used up all of my mobile data, I end up with $30 of actual credit which tends not to get used.
So I use that to buy Fate. :-)
On the Fate screen, when you go to buy Fate there's a link to SuperRewards which is the non-creditcard thing. From there, I click on Mobile, and it lists some options. (I'm not sure how it displays for people who aren't in Australia, so I won't try and write step-by-step instructions.)
But because the $30 I pay to my phone company is basically dead money (yes, downloading the contents of a floppy disk to my phone would cost almost three dollars), I can repurpose that and use it to buy Fate here - without it costing me any extra to do so.
This won't be useful for everyone, of course, but for anyone in a similar situation to me, this may be helpful.[/spoiler]
edited by Kittenpox on 6/9/2016
That is...quite an interesting option, actually. Thank you for bringing it to my attention, Kittenpox! I will keep that in mind. Who knows, maybe one day I decide to try that out
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Alt-Lana Loter
Main-Always Drunk Slav
"To see a world in a grain of sand, and Heaven in wild flowers.
To hold an infinity in palm of hand and Eternity in an hour”
Finally, I am Crooked Cross! Feel free to send invitations for Salon!
As of June 5th, 1895, I am London's newest Legendary Charisma!
The current progress in Mega Soul Grind: 53727/1 639 121 Souls
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BlabberingMat
Posts: 385
6/9/2016
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TheThirdPolice wrote:
BlabberMat wrote:
I need Deluxe Patent Scrutinizer for my Ambition, whre the Hell I get 320 Echoes? :O XD.
That is a lot of money for a new player, which is why there's an easier option: 3 sudden insights and a normal patent scrutinizer (costing 28.80). If you're not sure how to get the sudden insights, go to your Lodgings and play Chess with friends. (Many people on the forums will volunteer — I am not in London so I can't help you there.)
Oh, right...somehow, I completely overlooked that option... thank you for pointing that out to me!
And, as for the paying...well, I find myself quite content right now...and as I mentione in the first post, it is unlikely that I will be able to purchase the subscription anytime soon, so, I guess I am stuck with this.
--
Alt-Lana Loter
Main-Always Drunk Slav
"To see a world in a grain of sand, and Heaven in wild flowers.
To hold an infinity in palm of hand and Eternity in an hour”
Finally, I am Crooked Cross! Feel free to send invitations for Salon!
As of June 5th, 1895, I am London's newest Legendary Charisma!
The current progress in Mega Soul Grind: 53727/1 639 121 Souls
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Kittenpox
Posts: 869
6/9/2016
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I'm not sure how relevant this would be for you - and it's not specifically EF related, but is to do with buying Fate.
It was something I saw another forum user mention, and has been helpful for me, so I figure it may be worth sharing.
[spoiler]I don't buy Fate using credit card, etc. My mobile phone ('cell phone', for you Americans out there) is on a pre-paid thing, whereby I can pay my phone company about $30 to recharge and get a bunch of bonus credit and mobile data, which is usable within the next 30 days.
Given that I don't make *heaps* of calls, and I tend to use the data allowance over the course of a month, AND that my phone company charges $2/MB when I've used up all of my mobile data, I end up with $30 of actual credit which tends not to get used.
So I use that to buy Fate. :-)
On the Fate screen, when you go to buy Fate there's a link to SuperRewards which is the non-creditcard thing. From there, I click on Mobile, and it lists some options. (I'm not sure how it displays for people who aren't in Australia, so I won't try and write step-by-step instructions.)
But because the $30 I pay to my phone company is basically dead money (yes, downloading the contents of a floppy disk to my phone would cost almost three dollars), I can repurpose that and use it to buy Fate here - without it costing me any extra to do so.
This won't be useful for everyone, of course, but for anyone in a similar situation to me, this may be helpful.[/spoiler]
edited by Kittenpox on 6/9/2016
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Kittenpox
Current [Fabulous Diamond] count: Twenty-Five (of 50). Halfway there! ^_^
Metaphysical Caprice: 11.
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Currently: Returned to the Neath, and regaining my footing in this place. :-)
NO PLANT BATTLES PLEASE.
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TheThirdPolice
Posts: 609
6/9/2016
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You're fine. It's really a single player game, so the "disadvantages" compared to paying players don't really matter. The question is, is the free version of the game fun for you? Personally I find the free action & card reserve quite small, but I was happy to play with them for years as a 'coffee break game', logging on for two or three brief sessions a day. Content-wise, as a new player, there's a ton to explore. I will continue the pattern of this thread and admit I eventually did start paying for extra stories, and then for an Exceptional Friendship — but I didn't feel bored without them until the very late-game, well past POSI. (And even then there are regular free content updates and holidays to draw you back in.)
You'll see a lot of options to pay Fate to cure Menaces or skip grinds or avoid an item payment. I've never used these microtransactions, and personally I think they make the system look worse than it is. Unlike many free games, this one is balanced for free players, and the microtransactions are more like tips.
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Excessive Corpse & Tender to Irreal Ravens
Lover of Flawed Souls
And with especial pride, Worst Screwup of the Decade!
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BlabberingMat
Posts: 385
6/9/2016
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Thank you all for your replies, this is reassuring, because I often wander around the forum and keep seeing people talking about absurd quantities of Echoes and stuff like that, when I can barely gather my resources to buy things XD ( I need Deluxe Patent Scrutinizer for my Ambition, whre the Hell I get 320 Echoes? :O XD). At least I know that it is probably due to me not knowing how to gather resources rather than the system.
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Alt-Lana Loter
Main-Always Drunk Slav
"To see a world in a grain of sand, and Heaven in wild flowers.
To hold an infinity in palm of hand and Eternity in an hour”
Finally, I am Crooked Cross! Feel free to send invitations for Salon!
As of June 5th, 1895, I am London's newest Legendary Charisma!
The current progress in Mega Soul Grind: 53727/1 639 121 Souls
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suinicide
Posts: 2409
6/9/2016
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Exceptional friends also have to wait for actions, they just can hold more at a time. But beyond that, I was able to get to almost every content boundary without paying, and only started paying after that because I wanted more stories. There is maybe two cards to pressure you into paying. No real limiations if you don't pay.
edited by suinicide on 6/9/2016
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http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/profile/sunnytime
A gentleman seeking the liberation of knowledge, with a penchant for violence.
RIP suinicide, stuck in a well. Still has it under control.
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BlabberingMat
Posts: 385
6/9/2016
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In that case, Parelle, I shall waste no time in worrying about it anymore! But, really, thank you all for your insights, they've been more than useful!
One last remark, tho, just so that I don't look ungrateful or everything guys from Failbetter Games are doing for us: It's not that I don't want to give them money, in fact, I am seriously considering doing so one day. It is just the fact that I am a student, completely dependent on my parents' funds, and those are not really big. Maybe I should ask for one month of subscription in December, when my birthday is XD
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Alt-Lana Loter
Main-Always Drunk Slav
"To see a world in a grain of sand, and Heaven in wild flowers.
To hold an infinity in palm of hand and Eternity in an hour”
Finally, I am Crooked Cross! Feel free to send invitations for Salon!
As of June 5th, 1895, I am London's newest Legendary Charisma!
The current progress in Mega Soul Grind: 53727/1 639 121 Souls
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Kittenpox
Posts: 869
6/9/2016
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BlabberMat wrote:
At least I know that it is probably due to me not knowing how to gather resources rather than the system.
As you proceed through the game, there are more lucrative actions which become available.
When I was starting out, I was looking at getting maybe 0.10 Echoes worth of items from an action. Later, it was 0.50->0.70 Echoes per action. Nowadays, unless a random (non-story) repeatable action gives 1.5 Echoes worth of stuff, or items I need, then I don't bother doing it. :-p
So don't stress too much about hoarding wealth just yet.
Also, be mindful that the Ambition storylines are intended to be played alongside the others in the game. So don't try to rush through it as though you were chasing some kind of imaginary finish-line. Also, some (if not all) of them are not completed - my Light Fingers ambition, for example is still trailing behind the others. So by progressing through them at a steady pace rather than rushing forward, you'll be less likely to run into any content barriers that may arise.
Also, I would advise that you don't even consider the new SMEN content until you've thoroughly explored the game. The warnings are there for a very good reason. :-)
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Kittenpox
Current [Fabulous Diamond] count: Twenty-Five (of 50). Halfway there! ^_^
Metaphysical Caprice: 11.
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Currently: Returned to the Neath, and regaining my footing in this place. :-)
NO PLANT BATTLES PLEASE.
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Saklad
Posts: 528
6/9/2016
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Fallen London is almost entirely a free game. It never starts you on a story you can’t finish without Fate, and it never handicaps you with the intent of coercing you to spend any. Spending money just gets you even more stories.
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Saklad5, a man of many talents
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Grenem
Posts: 2067
6/9/2016
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Parelle wrote:
Grenen and I started almost at the same time (October 2014) and I only purchased Fate this week. Judging from the forums, I think we are some of the furtherest along players who aren't Extraordinary Friends.
I paid because I enjoy this game and wanted to support Failbetter (although I have no plans on getting EF, just using Fate for stories). I had played long enough that I knew what storylines I wanted to continue (I think suicide and I are speaking of the same two cards on this instance! Perhaps if they were just storylets in my lodgings I wouldn't have felt as much urge to pay for them).
Here's what I managed in a year and a half of playing every day without Fate
- all Stats at 200
- free Content boundary
- end point of my ambition
- best in a slot BDR (23, if you're wondering. I have to agree that BDR is the one place where straight up paying Fate would make it easier as gaining both +2 in slot weapon and companion shapes your playstyle a bit needing a ship on the early end and the home comfort slot requires a certain profession.)
- a nomen this past winter (though I'm not crazy enough to try the tatoo, I could see Grenen trying it next year)
- an Overgoat
- enough cash on hand that I could buy my second Overgoat if I sold almost everything except for the other Overgoat (but I won't)
- highest level player wedding (which is worth about 3000-5000 echoes, depending how costs were split)
- currently Notablity 8, but I've hit 13 before.
- 2 of the 3 five card lodgings (I don't have the 3rd upgradable option)
- Hallowmas is the one place I felt a bit antsy about not having EF as it's time-delimited but even without it I managed the 2nd highest level.
I have to strongly disagree with the idea that the only finished content is paid. The EF Stories are meant to be one-off complete in of themselves, so yes, they're supposed to end. There are plenty of completed storylines with meaningful endings
[spoiler]University, Cheesemonger, Last Constable, Rats, Affair of the Box, and Jack of Smiles, just off the top of my head, and the ambitions require no Fate at all to pursue. [/spoiler]
The drift does seem to be from completed storylines to carousels, as content continues, which I'm kinda ehhhhh on but that's fine - I'd definitely like more to be completed, but I didn't feel that I was lacking content: you can chose to pursue options which are more varied (and this, after all isn't something that paying Fate for really helps, I don't believe). I won't speak for Grenen, but I know they pursue expeditions diligently and I usually do a somewhat ridiculous number of heists a week (I did 18 in about 10 days without doing them full time).
Put it this way: being a non-EF (as I still am) actually means a higher level of engagement with the game: since everyone gains cards and actions alike at the same rate, you have to check in more often so not to "waste" actions or cards.
My accomplishments list, for comparison- it's about the same, but i thought i might as well compare: Not really intended to be bragging, as paraelle's are arguably better
-watchful at 200, other stats at high numbers.
-free content boundary
- current end point of my ambition [just the finale patch to go!]
- had best possible BDR, sort of ubergoat [23. once i get the goat, i'll have 25. unfortunately, i'd need one fate for that, and i spent all my free fate. hopefully i'll get one at some point in the future.]
- one 5 card lodging
- Overgoat, with enough money for a second [Probably without needing to sell airag or tears, though since it'd cut into my supplies...]
- had notability 10, but i dropped it for airag
- 1 of the five card lodgings
- highest level in hallowmas
- 30 vials of tears of the bazaar (each worth 312.5 echoes in sell price, and reasonably rare.)
- the following factions with connected over 300: Hell, constables, revolutionaries, bohemians.
- A cardinal of conspiriacy 9, which means at least 45 newspapers printed, each with the highest quality conspiriacy theories.
I don't feel i was lacking content. That said, while i used to pursue expeditions diligently, i toned it down a bit while i went and got the factions over 300 for the renown conversion: if they convert using the same scales as the last ones did, all of them, when they hit 321, will be equivalent to renown: 50. Which will be nice for bragging rights for a while.
edited by Grenem on 6/9/2016
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Married!:http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/takuza
I will accept all social actions that do not consume free evenings- and i will provide patronage to anyone who requests it, though it will be split between all requesters.
On psudeo-hiatus. Will be inactive and active and fluctuate without warning.
Grinding Favors without cards: http://community.failbettergames.com/topic22266-storylet-favors-grinding.aspx
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Esteban Delgado
Posts: 31
6/9/2016
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I have been playing since last December without paying anything, and am a POSI well on my way to an Overgoat (or would be if I hadn't decided to Seek the Name). Not paying does not hinder you, all the paid content gives is additional stories. Since there is no win/lose condition, not paying serves as no impediment to enjoying the game.
edited by Esteban Delgado on 6/9/2016
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I am Empty
http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Esteban~Delgado
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Harlocke
Posts: 506
6/9/2016
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Parelle wrote:
Put it this way: being a non-EF (as I still am) actually means a higher level of engagement with the game: since everyone gains cards and actions alike at the same rate, you have to check in more often so not to "waste" actions or cards.
That's one of the main draws of EF for me actually. I often don't have a chance to check the game every three hours to use my actions, or every hour to flip through my cards. It's nice being able to check the game every 6 hours without missing out on progress I otherwise could have made. Or wake up in the morning with 40 actions waiting for me. EF does help you advance faster in that sense, unless you'd otherwise play every 3 hours even in the middle of the night.
I probably wouldn't pay money just for that, but it also comes with the monthly story and the house of chimes. If you view each of those separate benefits as costing a $1-3 dollars a month individually, EF is a good value. Buying the story with fate later is more expensive than 1 month of EF, and you don't get the other benefits.
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I welcome social actions, and can visit your salon as an author.
http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Harlocke
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Grenem
Posts: 2067
6/9/2016
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BlabberMat wrote:
Now, I've been playing the FL for about three weeks now, and this is a question that had been bugging me ever since. I apologize if there is already topic on this, or if this is the wrong place for it...
My question is simple: I love this world, and I intend to keep playing as long as possible, but I have no means to pay for becoming an Exceptional Friend, or for Fate. Maybe I will one day, but for now, I am "doomed" to play the slow way, and wait for Actions. What I wonder is, is it worth it? How limited will my options be on the higher levels (after I become POSI, and up) if I don't pay? Is there any significant disadvantage compared to those who pay? Ecxcluding Fate-Locked content, of course. I'd like to hear from the high level people who are still playing for free ( if there are even someone like that XD)
Even EFs have to wait for actions, they just can stockpile more- it's so that progress feels like something you actually earned, rather than just clicking a button. it also means valuable items actually are valuable.
Your options will only be limited once you clear all, or at least most, free content, which could likely take six months if you move quickly, (Well, before seeking the name, at least. I expect that'll be long and painful and destroy everything your character worked for- but at least it's not a dull grind.) but you can probably find more things to do after that. While there are a few sections of the game unbalanced by fate, generally speaking, the game plays perfectly fine for free players. the best money grinds are available to them, and very little is properly unbalanced by fate. The only main issue is notability can become absurdly easy for a paying player, but most items don't need notability. There's probably one free storyline for each fate one, though i might be under or overestimating.
I've been playing for over a year, (two this hallowmas), and I can say that it's always been entertaining and i've never felt like that much of a second class citizen.
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Married!:http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/takuza
I will accept all social actions that do not consume free evenings- and i will provide patronage to anyone who requests it, though it will be split between all requesters.
On psudeo-hiatus. Will be inactive and active and fluctuate without warning.
Grinding Favors without cards: http://community.failbettergames.com/topic22266-storylet-favors-grinding.aspx
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Kittenpox
Posts: 869
6/9/2016
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I spent quite a long time before doing the Exceptional Friendship thing, and it's totally viable to do so.
Yes, I'm able to stockpile more actions (up to 40 total instead of 20 total) - but they don't accumulate any faster. We all have the 10-minute wait for each Action + Opportunity Card refresh. Besides, the game would get boring if I could do everything instantly fast. :-)
My suggestion would be to continue as you are, and later if you feel that you would like to spend money on the game then you're welcome to do so. If you feel like trying some of the Fate-locked stuff later, you're welcome to do so when the time comes.
(The Exceptional Friendship stories become available for Fate roughly 3 months after they're released, so you won't miss those either by not being an Exceptional Friend right now.)
PS:- A piece of advice: Avoid spending Fate to restore Actions, as there are MUCH better things you could be spending your Fate on. :-)
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Kittenpox
Current [Fabulous Diamond] count: Twenty-Five (of 50). Halfway there! ^_^
Metaphysical Caprice: 11.
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Currently: Returned to the Neath, and regaining my footing in this place. :-)
NO PLANT BATTLES PLEASE.
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TheThirdPolice
Posts: 609
6/9/2016
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BlabberMat wrote:
I need Deluxe Patent Scrutinizer for my Ambition, whre the Hell I get 320 Echoes? :O XD.
That is a lot of money for a new player, which is why there's an easier option: 3 sudden insights and a normal patent scrutinizer (costing 28.80). If you're not sure how to get the sudden insights, go to your Lodgings and play Chess with friends. (Many people on the forums will volunteer — I am not in London so I can't help you there.)
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Excessive Corpse & Tender to Irreal Ravens
Lover of Flawed Souls
And with especial pride, Worst Screwup of the Decade!
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BlabberingMat
Posts: 385
6/9/2016
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Kittenpox wrote:
BlabberMat wrote:
At least I know that it is probably due to me not knowing how to gather resources rather than the system.
Also, be mindful that the Ambition storylines are intended to be played alongside the others in the game. So don't try to rush through it as though you were chasing some kind of imaginary finish-line. Also, some (if not all) of them are not completed - my Light Fingers ambition, for example is still trailing behind the others. So by progressing through them at a steady pace rather than rushing forward, you'll be less likely to run into any content barriers that may arise.
Also, I would advise that you don't even consider the new SMEN content until you've thoroughly explored the game. The warnings are there for a very good reason. :-)
I figured so, yeah. I just wanted to give an extreme example. And, no, after I've read SMEN thread, I got out of that as soon as possible XD
--
Alt-Lana Loter
Main-Always Drunk Slav
"To see a world in a grain of sand, and Heaven in wild flowers.
To hold an infinity in palm of hand and Eternity in an hour”
Finally, I am Crooked Cross! Feel free to send invitations for Salon!
As of June 5th, 1895, I am London's newest Legendary Charisma!
The current progress in Mega Soul Grind: 53727/1 639 121 Souls
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