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A non spoiler guide to fate locked content?

Koenig Posts: 466 5/27/2015	My question is this: Can we could have a non-spoiler thread (No story content discussed) that could point players in a general direction when it involves items or companions that are part of Fate locked paths or events? More to the point, A simple list of Fate locked stories along with what rewards are available for playing them. (Possibly with a list of recommended levels and items for completing them) Note: I am well aware that fate locked content is not to be discussed (for good reason), however I am sure I am not the only one who would be far more inclined to buy and use Fate if I had a general idea as to what the long term goal would be. I don't want to see any content or stories spoiled because of something like this, but Instead have a point of reference before taking the plunge of dealing with fate. -- Koenig: Extraordinary. Invisible. Shattering. Legendary.
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Hannah Flynn Administrator Posts: 491 5/29/2015	(I've added some spoiler tags in the thread, as we're in spoiler territory with some of the summaries, particularly for The Gift. We'd remind everyone to be liberal with use of spoiler tags.) I appreciate all of this discussion and work, y'all are ace. I don't think we're quite at a solution though. My thoughts: Images aren't a good way of conveying information: they're not searchable or accessible (inc to screen readers) and they're not future proof. All of our content is subject to changes. Having this info in forum threads isn't great either. They'll drop off and be necro'd regularly. The forums aren't particularly searchable, nor are they the first place people go for information. It's worth noting that the Fate page will be updated in the next few months, and this has been really helpful in giving us a steer about what to include to make the fate-locked stories more attractive to people! It seems like you guys are getting towards a solution. I'd like to see where the discussion goes over the weekend, and if we need to revise/restate our position on how much information is available about fate-locked content - and where it should go - then we will do so next week. -- Wields the news canon, aboard the hype train.
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Estelle Knoht Posts: 1751 6/3/2015	[spoiler][/spoiler] I don't know how to warn people about the squad subtly. Or should I leave it out? But so many people complains about it. Also, I regret not echoing properly all these years ago. So much. Also, leaving the Foreign Office out for now because Carnelian Coast might tilt the place on its axis, very slightly. edited by Estelle Knoht on 6/3/2015 -- Estelle Knoht, a juvenile, unreliable and respectable lady. I currently do not accept any catbox, cider, suppers, calling cards or proteges.
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Estelle Knoht Posts: 1751 5/29/2015	[spoiler][/spoiler] Thanks for the feedback! I am not too sure about how specific I should be either. I was hoping to just make something that helps people to decide whether they buy a story, and maybe make a reasonable guess of what effect will their decisions have based on the list of reward / factions. Most of the time you can work it out pretty well, since FBG does signpost the final decision point pretty clearly. You'd still need to ask other for help to compare notes / smaller decisions / things. Still quite unsure about how specific I should be about reward numbers. I mean I keep seeing these posts about THE CARD FROM THE GIFT SUCKS, and I hope people can decide if they see what the cards give/ edited by Estelle Knoht on 5/29/2015 edited by Estelle Knoht on 5/29/2015 Hannah edit: adding spoiler tags edited by h4nchan on 5/29/2015 -- Estelle Knoht, a juvenile, unreliable and respectable lady. I currently do not accept any catbox, cider, suppers, calling cards or proteges.
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Estelle Knoht Posts: 1751 5/28/2015	Updated. Begging for input, PM and everything you have about fate-locked stories even though I played a lot of them I don't take notes Currently need details on: A Trade in Faces Blemmigan Affair The Gift Bound in Diocesan Intrigue Everything edited by Estelle Knoht on 5/29/2015 -- Estelle Knoht, a juvenile, unreliable and respectable lady. I currently do not accept any catbox, cider, suppers, calling cards or proteges.
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BlakeTheDrake Posts: 237 5/27/2015	I must say, you make strategic use of the cut-tool. "And an ultra-powerfulSTATIC" indeed. The Long-Lost Daughter is a storyline I decided to give a miss early on, but exemplifying the point of this debate... I might go back and buy it anyway, just to get the unique companion and that ultra-powerful MISSING. :p -- One of these days, I will remember to record interesting things in my journal... http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/BlakeTheDrake
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The Machinist Posts: 83 5/27/2015	Ian Hart wrote: Honestly, I'd appreciate clear-cut outcome summaries like these for non-Fate storylines as well! There are lots of stories I would have done differently, would have done sooner, or would not have done at all, had I known the mechanical consequences. Anything that adds a terrible opportunity card to my deck would be worth avoiding, for example. edited by Ian Hart on 5/27/2015 This is a big concern that's often overlooked. I've spent two weeks so far doing nothing but grinding The Student Body because I sold my soul so those blasted devils would drop their card out of my deck, and the last thing I need is another one coming in to clutter the place up. -- He has many a plan, many a scheme, many a hidden and whirring machine
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Sara Hysaro Moderator Posts: 4514 6/4/2015	The friendship will be damaged to the point that only a fairly significant amount of Fate will recover it. 20 Fate, to be precise. -- http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Sara%20Hysaro Please do not send SMEN, cat boxes, or Affluent Reporter requests. All other social actions are welcome. Are you a Scarlet Saint? Send a message my way to be added to the list.
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Estelle Knoht Posts: 1751 5/27/2015	[spoiler] [/spoiler] Cons: Hazy memory, Highly Subjective, Bad Grasp on game mechanics, Laziness, Cannot read between the lines (Tricked by Mr Chimes for 3 years and running), Vulnerable to Tiger-Keeper, Parabolan-Weasels edited by Estelle Knoht on 5/27/2015 Hannah edit: Adding spoiler tags edited by h4nchan on 5/29/2015 -- Estelle Knoht, a juvenile, unreliable and respectable lady. I currently do not accept any catbox, cider, suppers, calling cards or proteges.
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Kaigen Posts: 530 5/27/2015	The right half of that image is cut off for me. Is there a link where I can view the full image? -- Just a simple doctor with a chess habit. Publisher of The Flit Dispatch. "One must remember that the impossible is, alas, always possible." -Jacques Derrida
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Estelle Knoht Posts: 1751 5/27/2015	Er. It was intentional because I have barely started on making it. Sorry. I wiill chew on that for a bit and get the regular fate stories done first, I suppose? -- Estelle Knoht, a juvenile, unreliable and respectable lady. I currently do not accept any catbox, cider, suppers, calling cards or proteges.
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BlakeTheDrake Posts: 237 5/27/2015	I second this. Deciding to buy into something fate-locked because it looks like it might be interesting is one thing, but knowing that a particularly useful reward awaits at the end of a fate-locked section is certainly also a factor in such purchases. Basically, I don't see how a 'directory' like this could HURT the game's cash-flow - if anything, it's more likely to make some people go "Oh, I had no idea you could get THAT! Better buy some Fate and go grab it!" -- One of these days, I will remember to record interesting things in my journal... http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/BlakeTheDrake
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Danko Posts: 142 5/27/2015	I agree completely. Having some general description of the content you're buying could only help with decisions and boost sales. In fact, since I'm finding myself buying lots of fate-locked stories lately, I'm considering making such a guide myself in the future, and I already have a little draft. What could be in it: general overview of the story (something close to what you can see on the NEX tab description), description of the length of story (aka 5 storylets + 5 opportunity cards, etc), general description of permanent cards (aka unlocks 1 permanent useful storylet/opp. card), general overview of the rewards and unique items (such as "during the story you will receive a unique transportation item"), maybe some comments from the fate thread (aka "the story has received favourable reviews, praising it for interesting lore and useful material rewards"). What won't be in the guide: obviously, any story text, spoilers, item names I wonder if that would be okay. I should talk it over with FB some time. I also have no qualms about anyone making their own guide, personally! edited by Danko on 5/27/2015 -- http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Danko
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Kade Carrion (an_ocelot) Posts: 1372 5/28/2015	I appreciate the work that's gone into this, but images are a really unfriendly way of transmitting information; can it please just be text? -- Social Actions: send them to Kade Carrion (she/her; no Tournament of Lilies, please). an_ocelot has gone NORTH and cannot benefit from social actions! Possibly-Useful Things: Spreadsheets and hints and link collections, oh my.
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RandomWalker Posts: 948 5/28/2015	I like the images, and the coloured text does help with readability. Thumbs up. I'm just really annoyed with myself at not keeping notes, or I could fill in a lot of the blanks. Oh well.
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MissCrumpet Posts: 113 5/28/2015	Estelle Knoht wrote: Begging for input, PM and everything you have about fate-locked stories even though I played a lot of them I don't take notes Currently need details on: A Trade in Faces Blemmigan Affair The Gift Bound in Diocesan Intrigue Everything edited by Estelle Knoht on 5/28/2015 This is great! I also wonder if the more specific info on rewards is breaking the spoilers rule. I don't know if specifying how much connected points or deep amber is necessary, though, so I think this chart is really useful even if you have to remove those details. Other Fate-locked stories: Flute Street The two extra archaeological expeditions in the Forgotten Quarter I'm trying to think of more... There are tons of other Fate-unlocked items (Merry Gentleman card option, the option to clear lacre, and many special event dependent things), but they aren't really stories. -- Julia C, a creatively named lady. I am always looking to expand my circle of acquaintances and enjoy pleasant social interactions.
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BlakeTheDrake Posts: 237 5/28/2015	Concerning the 'long-lost daughter' story... where the difference between the two possible endings is stark indeed. Could anyone tell me how I make sure I go for the more... profitable ending? I've gone through the story just now, and reached a juncture where I must choose to trust, or not. My instinct tells me to be... skeptical, but I really don't want to take any chances. Well, I suppose I'm mainly fishing for a helping PM, but it DOES raise an important question - namely, whether it's possible to put some cryptic information into these fate-storyline descriptions to help guide people towards their desired endings without spoilers. Generic statements that only make sense when you're facing the actual choice, y'know? For example, with The Gift, [spoiler]one could say "For the second ending, give of yourself freely."[/spoiler] Makes no sense on its own, but when you're facing the final choice, the meaning becomes abundantly clear. Hannah edit: adding spoiler tags edited by h4nchan on 5/29/2015 -- One of these days, I will remember to record interesting things in my journal... http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/BlakeTheDrake
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BlakeTheDrake Posts: 237 5/28/2015	Thanks for the clues... well, you might have a point about people preferring to make pure, 'character'-based choices. I can certainly understand that. But that DOES mean that if you're deliberately aiming for a particular outcome, you ARE going to wind up worrying. After all, even if they CAN be reset, doing so costs a load of Fate... nobody wants to go through a 25-fate storyline looking for a particular reward, wind up making the wrong choice somewhere, and then be faced with either giving up on their desire or paying ANOTHER 25 fate to take another shot at it... -- One of these days, I will remember to record interesting things in my journal... http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/BlakeTheDrake
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BlakeTheDrake Posts: 237 5/28/2015	True, though I'd venture that The Gift really, really DOESN'T let you know a damn thing about what you get out of it in the end. It also isn't always obvious WHEN you're at the final choice - as is the case with The Long-Lost Daughter - which can lead to unnecessary dithering and worrying about a seemingly-important choice that turns out to be merely penultimate. But yeah - definitely a lot of pros and cons and double-edged swords in this subject. Perhaps better to err on the side of caution, as you suggested. Asking for information over PM is a useful exercise in social networking, after all... :p -- One of these days, I will remember to record interesting things in my journal... http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/BlakeTheDrake
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dov Posts: 2580 5/29/2015	My take on the new opp card from The Gift is that, while it is useless in terms of echo-value it provides, the story was SO GOOD that when I see the card pop up I'm not annoyed at the useless card, but fondly remember the storyline. And I'd really appreciate a PM regarding whether the Long-Lost Daughter story is considered worth it (I thought most people did not recommend it) and what are the Nadir implications of that story. -- Want a sip of Hesperidean Cider? Send me a request in-game. Here's an_ocelot's guide how. (Most social actions are welcome. Please no requests to Loiter Suspiciously and no investigations of the Affluent Photographer)
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Danko Posts: 142 5/29/2015	Estelle, do you consider making such guide for other fate-locked stories that aren't accessible from Nex page, such as Labyrinth of Tigers, Secrets Framed in Gold, Flute Street and other significant stories? There are quite a few, and honestly I think they're just as important. I would also appreciate a more spoiler-free version, possibly? Without showing choices and rewards. -- http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Danko
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Kylestien Posts: 749 5/29/2015	As it is I like the current guide, though I'd love to see additions with the other fate content. as for rewards, I like knowing them. For example, i brought the Long Lost Daughter card for the Nadir option. -- I will accept all actions, though I hold the right to refuse for my own reasons. However, if you explain WHY you send me a harmful action like Loitering or Dantes,And I feel the reason good, I will consider it more. http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Kylestien Persuasive patron. You want a lesson, send me a message asking for one.
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Estelle Knoht Posts: 1751 5/29/2015	I will do the higher level stories in a day or two. Spoiler-free version... Sure, why not? -- Estelle Knoht, a juvenile, unreliable and respectable lady. I currently do not accept any catbox, cider, suppers, calling cards or proteges.
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RandomWalker Posts: 948 5/30/2015	Oops - good point with regards to pets - apologies. I really think that the mechanical rewards are important to some players, and knowledge of them would encourage purchases. Other players want to play for stories, and so spoilers are far from welcome. I think that there is a real need for both approaches. A relatively spoiler-free summary of options such as the one you wrote for the Secrets of Beasts, but maybe with a short, spoiler-free review ('forum opinion is that Secrets of Beasts is a solid purchase, with both interesting lore and useful unique material rewards. Access to other Fate-locked content is required to fully explore content') and another in Estelle's format with more spoilers / detailed mechanical summary, such as: [spoiler] Secrets of Beasts offers one of the best methods to get SotC from 1 to 10, especially for those banished from court, and, players will eventually earn a companion with equal-highest BDR in the game (requires access to Flute Street). Like most other fate purchases, the EPA of this storyline is not better than free-to-play options.[/spoiler] Not sure what the forum consensus is for this story. Insert your own blurb here. edited by RandomWalker on 5/30/2015
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Estelle Knoht Posts: 1751 5/30/2015	Hey, a spoiler-free version isn't a bad idea - someone did just make a post asking for one! I think your non-spoiler list could be pretty useful on the Wiki - Category:Fate is a bit too messy. An overview of major storyline to buy is useful for planning, too - just think of it like an expanded Fate tab! I will get a text version up. Soon. When I am not lazy. Then the higher level stories. But I like using image because I enjoy giving the Captivating Princess a black eye and force everyone to look at it on the guide and feel my contempt!!!!!! edited by Estelle Knoht on 5/30/2015 -- Estelle Knoht, a juvenile, unreliable and respectable lady. I currently do not accept any catbox, cider, suppers, calling cards or proteges.
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Kaigen Posts: 530 5/30/2015	The Wiki is probably a good place for a spoiler-light/free version of the guide, as a more detailed listing might crop up too frequently in searches, leading to people getting inadvertently spoiled. -- Just a simple doctor with a chess habit. Publisher of The Flit Dispatch. "One must remember that the impossible is, alas, always possible." -Jacques Derrida
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Koenig Posts: 466 5/31/2015	To some degree of relevance, what storylet/card/location provides me with the fate locked option(s) that allow me to work towards Bifurcated Owl? I am hell bent on getting the creature if it is still possible, however I don't know where to start at this point (Though I am busy collected non fate animals for breeding at current) -- Koenig: Extraordinary. Invisible. Shattering. Legendary.
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Sara Hysaro Moderator Posts: 4514 5/31/2015	It's at the end of the "Solving Cases around Fallen London" storyline you unlock after finishing the University. You'll get a card that allows you to purchase access into Flute Street, where you can get the Rubbery Hound for breeding. -- http://fallenlondon.storynexus.com/Profile/Sara%20Hysaro Please do not send SMEN, cat boxes, or Affluent Reporter requests. All other social actions are welcome. Are you a Scarlet Saint? Send a message my way to be added to the list.
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Kittenpox Posts: 869 6/2/2015	After recently having found that I can use my mobile credit to buy Fate/Nex, I've finally been able to buy 100-ish Fate and start unlocking stuff. So this sort of information is really useful to me. Knowing which stories are useful or have helpful rewards would be really handy, so I looked through the forums at peoples comments (and Estelle's chart) Since then, I've bought the Soul Trade story, and the Fate purchases for a Zubmarine, Inconvenienced By Your Aunt, and Uncovering Secrets Framed In Gold. Sara Hysaro wrote: It's at the end of the "Solving Cases around Fallen London" storyline you unlock after finishing the University. You'll get a card that allows you to purchase access into Flute Street, where you can get the Rubbery Hound for breeding. Ah, I did wonder about that one! I've heard Flute street is really good, but never knew where to find it until now. (I've been avoiding progress in the University because it was a reliable way to reduce Nightmares - though lately I've found the wonders of Laudanum, so maybe it's time I moved onwards.) -- Kittenpox Current [Fabulous Diamond] count: Twenty-Five (of 50). Halfway there! ^_^ Metaphysical Caprice: 11. - Currently: Returned to the Neath, and regaining my footing in this place. :-) NO PLANT BATTLES PLEASE.
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RandomWalker Posts: 948 6/3/2015	I like it. I think you hit the 'Spinning of the Wheels' right - you give enough information for people to make a decision, or else ask for spoilers. You seem to use red for bad or negative statements, apart from the line in Flute Street, which I feel is a positive. Is this deliberate, or am I reading too much into the colour coding?
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Estelle Knoht Posts: 1751 6/3/2015	RandomWalker wrote: You seem to use red for bad or negative statements, apart from the line in Flute Street, which I feel is a positive. Is this deliberate, or am I reading too much into the colour coding? Most of the time, but there are slip-ups with the color now and then. -- Estelle Knoht, a juvenile, unreliable and respectable lady. I currently do not accept any catbox, cider, suppers, calling cards or proteges.
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Diptych Administrator Posts: 3493 6/4/2015	I don't mind telling you openly that the Forger is a trustworthy sort of fellow... though he might not have full access to the facts. One might push the matter, have the complete story... and the Bazaar is terribly fond of stories. Indeed, having so fine a story as this to offer it might even unlock one's Destiny... but the Forger's friendship would have be sacrificed along the way. It's up to you to decide which you value more. -- Sir Frederick, the Libertarian Esotericist. Lord Hubris, the Bloody Baron. Juniper Brown, the Ill-Fated Orphan. Esther Ellis-Hall, the Fashionable Fabian.
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The Machinist Posts: 83 6/4/2015	I'm a touch more concerned with what the canvas and the details of its contents would sell for. That, and if my friendship with the Forger can, as so many things in the ever shifting Neath, be recovered with time. I feel it unlikely I would stop this pursuit when there remains something yet to lose, and yet, I wonder... -- He has many a plan, many a scheme, many a hidden and whirring machine
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A non spoiler guide to fate locked content?